[news] Ai Kago suspended indefinitely from H!P for smoking

[drewbilation]

^ Yeah, like what happened with Nacchi's scandal back in '04.

[SunshineSlayer]

Originally Posted by nmskalmn

You can live without smoking. That law applies to every 18 yr old in Japan, not just Hello! Project members.

Yes, but the problem is that law is almost never enforced. I would say at least 50% of underage highschoolers in Japan smoke. Japan is a smoking country, it doesn't have the same negative stigma to it that is attached to it in the US and some other countries. Only now are they starting to get a little bit more smoking conscious. The only reason Kago is getting in trouble for this is because she is an "idol." Which is one of the many reasons why I'm glad Ayu got out of that business.

Originally Posted by Brittany

She probably got fined by the ones that caught her .

No she didn't. Law enforcement or any legalities have not gotten involved at all. The only people making a big deal out of this is her own Agency and the crazy fan boys.

She is an 18 year old girl who made a mistake and had a cigarette. She does not in any way deserve the way she is being treated now. W's album and single have even been cancelled. I'm thinking there might be something else going on behind the scenes for Up Front Agency to be having this big of a reaction. (It's primarily them that make these decisions, not Tsunku as far as I know.)

In short, cut the girl some slack. She is allowed to have a rebellious streak at her age - if she didn't, she would be sub-human. Let these girls live and make their mistakes.

Originally Posted by walking proud

I think that she deserves the same treatment as everyone else in Japan, but suspension is a bit far....

If she got the same treatment as a normal person in Japan, nothing would happen to her. After having lived in Japan, trust me, most people consider this law a joke. It was created in 1900(!). I've seen teens smoke all the time on school grounds, with teachers around and the most anyone ever does is tell them to put it out.(but even that is rare, usually because the teachers themselves are smokers^_^)

And of COURSE Kago knows smoking is bad for you. But smoking isn't the problem, it is the symptom of a problem. Her just quitting smoking won't solve the original problem be it stress or weight issues or what not. I personally believe she started smoking a few months ago because you saw her slim down a bit. You'd be suprised how many girls take up smoking to lose weight rather than dieting because it is a quick fix. And really, with the amount of pressure that there is to be petite in Japan(even more so than the US), I can understand the reasons why she would. Not that it is right, but I can put myself in someone elses shoes and understand.

Obviously I'm passionate about this subject. It just bugs me that so many "fans" can be so devoted to these girls, but the second that they make any sort of mistake people turn their backs on them. They really aren't allowed to make mistakes and be human.

As I've said before, I think the whole idol industry needs a major change because as it is now I think any psychologist would tell you it is emotionally and mentally unhealthy for the girls in the long run. Mari had the right idea to get out.

[aiko_hoshi]

exactly. she is an IDOL. she isn't supposed to be seen as a human, but something more than that.
and showing that she smokes isn't an IDOL behavior.

kago knows this. it's her fault. and now she has to deal with the backlash.

[SunshineSlayer]

Originally Posted by aiko_hoshi

exactly. she is an IDOL. she isn't supposed to be seen as a human, but something more than that.
and showing that she smokes isn't an IDOL behavior.

kago knows this. it's her fault. and now she has to deal with the backlash.

As I just said, the idol industry needs to change. It puts completely unrealistic and unfair expectations on these girls.

[bluegie]

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

As I just said, the idol industry needs to change. It puts completely unrealistic and unfair expectations on these girls.

I quite disagree with you on this topic. Like I said, idols are people worshipped by lots of people, especially the young ones. If kago smoking is nothing at all, what do the young girls think? They will probly say that "it looks really cool to smoke" or "i wanna be like kago... if I smoke, people will respect me blah blah". It's like aibon is delivering a wrong message to the young ones. To me it's not about the crazy boy-fans or the management team (probly they may have a different meaning to kago's smoking tho ). I dun care what those stupid boys or upright's doing. I just care about the negative impact on the teenager's somking habit..

[ohsixthirty]

it just seems really harsh to kick her out...

[nmskalmn]

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

Yes, but the problem is that law is almost never enforced. I would say at least 50% of underage highschoolers in Japan smoke. Japan is a smoking country, it doesn't have the same negative stigma to it that is attached to it in the US and some other countries. Only now are they starting to get a little bit more smoking conscious.

Then this is a step in the right direction. She is in the public eye and if people, especially younger H!P members, look up to her that is every reason to come down harshly. I just don't see why you think it's okay for this girl to smoke and not face any consequences.

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

As I've said before, I think the whole idol industry needs a major change because as it is now I think any psychologist would tell you it is emotionally and mentally unhealthy for the girls in the long run. Mari had the right idea to get out.

Probably, but that's a whole other topic from smoking.

[bluegie]

Originally Posted by touchedstar

it just seems really harsh to kick her out...

oh they haven't kicked her out yet. i bet it will be another 2-3 month suspension

[SunshineSlayer]

Originally Posted by nmskalmn

Then this is a step in the right direction. She is in the public eye and if people, especially younger H!P members, look up to her that is every reason to come down harshly. I just don't see why you think it's okay for this girl to smoke and not face any consequences.


Probably, but that's a whole other topic from smoking.

I never said that. I'm saying it's unfair that she is the only one facing consequences for this and if she weren't an idol it wouldn't be happening and that the consequence does not fit the crime.

And normally smoking and idols would be two different things but in this case they are directly related.

I'm just dissatisfied with the whole idol making machine. I love a lot of the music in H!P and I think the girls are great. What I don't like however is that they are not allowed to do anything even remotely wrong which is an essential part of growing up. And, you know, unless someone commits a serious crime, they should be able to do that without losing their careers. ^_^ I really don't think that is asking too much. Otherwise they will just grow up to be very emotionally stunted adults and I certainly don't want another situation like what happened with Okada Yukiko to arise.

Really, it's many peoples reaction to this that bugs me more than the situation itself. Not necassarily here, but on other boards and on Japanese boards where things are being said like, "she should just go become a housewife now" or "she is a useless human being who should go away and good riddance." These coming from the same people who just a few days ago would have bought a Kago t-shirt but now since she doesn't fit what their idea of perfect is anymore she is "useless." Like she is just a piece of property that belongs to them. THAT aspect of the idol industry definitely needs to change.

Originally Posted by bluegie

I quite disagree with you on this topic. Like I said, idols are people worshipped by lots of people, especially the young ones. If kago smoking is nothing at all, what do the young girls think?

As far as I can tell there really aren't many kids in the fandom anymore. And if kids are going to get any idea about smoking it would first be from their parents, teachers, parents friends' etc. Kids grow up with a lot of smoking adults in Japan.

[*Petit*]

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

Really, it's many peoples reaction to this that bugs me more than the situation itself. Not necassarily here, but on other boards and on Japanese boards where things are being said like, "she should just go become a housewife now" or "she is a useless human being who should go away and good riddance." These coming from the same people who just a few days ago would have bought a Kago t-shirt but now since she doesn't fit what their idea of perfect is anymore she is "useless." Like she is just a piece of property that belongs to them. THAT aspect of the idol industry definitely needs to change.

I thought that was kind of the whole deal of the japanese aidoru persona. They're not supposed to be "people", they're objects of entertainment. Kind of like the old Geisha was a living doll. To me it seems that this applies especially to the H!P girls. They are always "acting" girly, doing totally useless and stupid things, things that are very entertaining and *Kawaii* though. These "illutions" seems to be a tradition in Japanese culture.

One of ayumi hamasaki's strongest points was (it seems to me at least) that she managed to break through the aidoru status little by little, first and foremost through her lyrics. But she still was considered an aidoru in the beginning, and thus her appeal was directed towards both the ones that enjoy the idols and the fans looking for more "honest" and less manufactured artists. (come to think of it Ayumi actually managed to seem super manufactured and honest at the same time O.o f.ex duty and LOVEppears times.)

[SunshineSlayer]

Originally Posted by *Petit*

I thought that was kind of the whole deal of the japanese aidoru persona. They're not supposed to be "people", they're objects of entertainment.

Yep that's pretty much exactly what it is. I just don't see how it is healthy at all, especially for young girls. Having to only be cute and positive all the time(primarily for the enjoyment of middle aged men) and having to ignore what your less happy emotions are I think would take an emotional and psychological toll on anybody.

And yes, I'm really proud of Ayumi too. I also think that is where much of her inspiration for songs like Real Me and My Names Women comes from - her experiences working as an idol when she was younger.

[ImpactBreaker]

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

I'm just dissatisfied with the whole idol making machine. I love a lot of the music in H!P and I think the girls are great. What I don't like however is that they are not allowed to do anything even remotely wrong which is an essential part of growing up. And, you know, unless someone commits a serious crime, they should be able to do that without losing their careers. ^_^ I really don't think that is asking too much. Otherwise they will just grow up to be very emotionally stunted adults and I certainly don't want another situation like what happened with Okada Yukiko to arise.

she didn't do something wrong, she broke a law. that is far beyond wrong. If they decided to enforce the rules on her but doesn't do it in other japanese people, then the problem is not in this particular case but in many others. The Hello! project company hires underaged girls so I'm sure they pretty much set strict rules in orders fopr them not to be sued. If one of their members broke a law they can't just go hands open and embrace their crime.
If people killed each other in streets and the police didn't do anyrthing and one day an artist killed someone and the artist goes under arrest, would it be harsh for the artist? obviously not. We can't distort facts just because wrong things indeed do happen.
And doing wrong things is not exactly a part of growing up. I grew up without doing them

As for the AIDORU industry, they exist because there are people willing to working for them. Are they cruel? well I think children amnd teens should be studying and not doing business. If they decide to go so young into the dubious and cruel world of fame, that's their own risk. We can't feel sorry for them. The consequences are pretty much well known (fast rises, quicker falls)

[marty518]

Originally Posted by nmskalmn

You can live without smoking. That law applies to every 18 yr old in Japan, not just Hello! Project members.

I unfortunately have to agree. It is a ridiculous rule, of course, but it is a rule that must be obeyed. While underage smoking is a problem everywhere, Ai also had to realize that smoking is against the rules of H!P. As we all know, they can't do lots of things. If they appear "tainted," then 50 year old men won't be as willing to pleasure themselves thinking about the girls. And that is the most important thing about H!P (for the people in charge at least).

As sad as it is, those girls sign away their souls when they join, and if they break a rule, punishment must be enforced.

[ImpactBreaker]

Also, if people think being an idol is being exploited, then why not be happy that she got a suspension from a slavery work?

[SunshineSlayer]

Originally Posted by ImpactBreaker

she didn't do something wrong, she broke a law. that is far beyond wrong.

And once again, there is absolutely no law enforcement involved in this.

I'm tired of arguing about this. I just can't believe that so many people are completely unwilling to show her any sort of compassion. I find that quite sadening. Especially since you were just specifically saying that people have too angellic a view of Ayu at all times in the Startin' PV discussion thread, this is the same thing but in a different situation. I doubt Ayu was a perfect little angel durring her teen years as she has hinted at on several occasions.

Kago is a human being with flaws just like everyone else. I'm not saying she should go unpunished, but really this should not be being dealt with as seriously as it is, not by a long shot. I almost wish she were being punished by the police as that punishement would actually be less severe. She is not only being punished, she is being shamed.(they have removed all merchandise and images of her at the H!P store locations and will be cutting her out of the upcoming Hello Mornings either completley or with a mosaic on her face.) What she needs now more than anything is peoples support, not for people to turn their back on her and I just find it odd that fans of hers have to be convinced of that. She obviously has some problems that need to be worked through or she wouldn't be smoking in the first place.

And we could be here all night talking about what is wrong with the idol business, but I'm not going to. If people don't see anything wrong with it then

edited to add: If I'm sounding too emphatic or overbearing about this subject, I don't mean to be, so I'm sorry for that. This issue just unexpectedly got under my skin for some reason.

[[ Melinda ]]

Originally Posted by dokidokisuru

^ Yeah, like what happened with Nacchi's scandal back in '04.

Nacchi -scandal? What happened there?

[bluegie]

I understand what you're saying, SunshineSlayer. I dun think fans will turn their back on her (except probly those hardcore boy-fans thinking aibon is an angel). We're just pointing out the fact about what aibon should had known about the consequences before she got caught on smoking. I know ayu smokes, and I know she was probly a bad girl when she was young (I think many fans know about that). When I knew ayu smokes, I had two worries: her health and the negative impact on youngsters. I only hate ayu smokes (the habit), but I dun hate her in person.

Therefore I know why you feel sad about this punishment.. but aibon is a different case. She's been set up as a innocent girl in the beginning by the management team. We know that "innocent girl doesn't smoke". This is the image of aibon. Being a funny girl, love teasing people, yet innocent. She could be forced to be like that, but it's the path she's chosen. If she breaks the image, she breaks the contract as well. Standing in the management's shoes you would suspend aibon as well. Let's think in this way... probly the suspension is just a way of the team to convert aibon from innocent image (which it's broken according to boy-fans) to something else. Probly it's good for her... so she can act more naturally later on.

It's just bad that aibon started with this image. Ayu didn't try to be innocent and cute in the beginning... Thus it may be easier for the public to accept her doing something not really good (e.g., drinks a lot and smokes...) . Same goes to kumi. Some people may think she loves sex and probly loves doing all sorts of cool things, and I always thought she smokes and consumes alcohols... Then I just found out earlier that she doesn't smoke or drink . So here you go, each image must have its own sacrifices.

Originally Posted by [ Melinda ]

Nacchi -scandal? What happened there?

she plagiarized someone's poem or writings and used on her photobook or something. People found out that in Dec 2004 (and her thing was released back in 2000 or sth..). She's been suspended by the management for like 2 to 3 months. Her popularity did decline quite a bit after this event..

[ImpactBreaker]

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

And we could be here all night talking about what is wrong with the idol business, but I'm not going to. If people don't see anything wrong with it then

No, I actually agree to some extent with you about the idol business. I think it can be extremely rough on the girls and it is a bad thing. My point of view is that such things shouldn't exist. The idea of seeing underaged people being launched in media, having to bear all the pressure from it seriously bothers me. Kago did choose to become an idol though, so she was probably been told about behaviors and stuff (if the company had just randomly suspended her she could sue the company back).

edited to add: If I'm sounding too emphatic or overbearing about this subject, I don't mean to be, so I'm sorry for that. This issue just unexpectedly got under my skin for some reason.

Don't worry, this thread was made to discuss You didn't sound overbearing to me.

[Alessia_Tateno]

for what I know, W new album date is cancelled because of this -.- I dont think Tsunku likes to act like that but the business is business you understand?

[hallelujah_united]

Well, underaged smoking is still a crime since there is a law prohibiting it, and therefore Kago has to be punished. Otherwise underaged people all over Japan are going to be even more confident that they can get away with it than they already are. It's sad but necessary, because she is after all in the public eye.

But it's true that underaged smoking is a really big problem around the world, and there is a need to tackle it more seriously. I'm happy that H!P is taking an appropriate stance (firing her would have been bad because after all she is only 18 and most probably wouldn't have been able to cope with the disappointment) on this issue.

Even though she's committed such a mistake, I hope that she'll be able to bounce back and put this issue behind her. She's been punished, now it's time for her to learn from it and move on.