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| · Ayu's Official Site · Ayu's twitter · Ayu's YouTube · masa's translations · Misa-chan's translations · |
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#241
30th January 2018, 05:03 PM
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Live version of Jolin Tsai's I'm Not Yours featuring Namie that was recorded from Jolin's Play World Tour
https://jenie.co/song-jolin-tsai-im-...-tour-livem4a/
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#242
30th January 2018, 10:46 PM
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#243
31st January 2018, 11:49 AM
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#244
31st January 2018, 01:02 PM
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#245
1st February 2018, 07:18 PM
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Until recently Namie was definitely a big name in my playlists. Sadly, the tv interview she did in December changed it all, and from now on I am about to express my not very pleasant opinion. It’s an extremely rare situation, that the opinion of the artists I listen to, their attitude or actions influence my view of the artist. This interview appeared to be such case. To be honest it`s not something shocking since most of these things I already thought Namie is but her actually admitting to it just made me feel so toxic about her and before that I simply wouldn`t want to believe it in a way... Namie is gone from my playlists and files I downloaded. I have lost every single piece of respect towards her and I will explain why.
First of all, she is currently 40 and, as she said, she started considering retirement in her late ...20s. I am sorry but do I need to repeat? 20s! If it was the shock of becoming popular or something like that I would understand but no - in the interview, this motive keeps coming back in the span of her whole career. The only reason why she pursued was the dream she decided on, which was to give a huge final concert which happened to be her 20th anniversary Dome tour. After its huge success, she kept thinking of retirement but decided to make things even more interesting by...retiring during the 25th anniversary, release an album a year till then and keep touring. As much as I enjoyed Namie’s music and concerts this attitude is simply outrageous to me. She has made the image of a martyr. What kind of person, who supposedly likes their job keeps thinking about retirement for the whole length of their professional life? Then there was an initial period with Komuro who produced her early hits. She mentioned huge pressure she felt due to the fact many other Komura’s clients were selling well. Again I got vibes of vulnerable, weak girl who didn’t know where she was. Also, during Komuro’s period, she was guided about every single thing by him: how the song would be recorded, jackets, promotion videos, how to perform the songs… she had literally no single thing to say and she was happy (or sad, who knows now) with such state. All she would do was perform. After this she was left on her own, to be her own producer, and she was totally lost as she said herself. What did she do? She was being an observant “music producer”, definitely not an artist. She admitted that there was a lot of trial and error and by watching the audience she knew what songs were bad. In other words, she just wanted to please the crowds and create things so they sell well - the end of the story. The only positive thing she says is that she has learned to enjoy singing and dancing at the same time, and the moment she started enjoying her work was….learning that it should give her joy….She says she found it but I will not believe it, since she kept thinking about retirement. I have no words. Then, there is a reason why she stopped going to tv and that was: “I am not a very intelligent person and have nothing interesting to say”. She said that saying something interesting became a burden to her. I didn’t know that in shows like Music Station or others you are quizzed from the history, or they check your IQ. This is the same reason why she resigned from MCs. This interview was very revealing. What I saw was Namie being a mainstream follower who is much more performer and the producer of music that would sell, very little passion though, rather then an artist. I try to never do that in public discussions but I will mention Ayu. We may have varied opinions about her music, but she has never, even in the darkest hour said that she was tired. Not only that, she is totally opposite to Namie in this department. Her hearing has been getting worse with time but each time she speaks out, she keeps emphasising how she will not stop singing because it’s her life and those are not words to be taken lightly. She has learned acrobatics, her shows are always spectacular and even if repetitive at times - they are big, bright, theatrical and even if you don’t like Ayu, find her music boring - she knows how to put on a show. She is very involved in the creation process, writing all her lyrics makes her superior to Namie already. Speaking of lyrics, Namie’s English is horrible and without checking the words of songs on the internet - I wouldn’t be able to tell a lot of it. With Ayu, it’s not the case anymore that much. And there is no excuse, if you do something and earn really good money - do it well, learn those few lines at least, by heart. How, after being a fan of such passionate artist like Ayu, I am supposed to just ignore what Namie said, how she made herself a victim of her success? I don’t even believe that she actually decides about jackets and all. The moment she opened her mouth I realized how much Ayu deserves to be called an artist and Namie simply a performer while I used to think of Ayu as a performer with passion. It’s understandable she kept herself quiet, because if she talked people would see how very uninteresting and to some point fake she was. Namie was produced, during all her career, even when she was her boss all she did was produce goods in the forms of music. She just wanted to sell and feel the joy of fans during concerts who had no clue that she put very little heart in her works. Because of her feeling like a martyr, lack of passion and retiring finally, I am very much not interested in what happens to her professionally. I am glad she is retiring, she was very overrated in my opinion and did not deserve the publicity she got. This is it tbh.. I hope no one`s gonna start bashing me like crazy although it wouldn`t be surprising because that`s what simply tends to happen when one expresses their negative opinion about somebody or something and especially with a topic like Namie who`s barely critisized, it is something that can expected...
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Last edited by Katsuyuki012; 2nd February 2018 at 01:41 AM. |
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#246
1st February 2018, 07:29 PM
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#247
1st February 2018, 07:57 PM
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I don't think anyone will start bashing you because everything you said it's true, we all know it, and, surprisingly, we don't care lol everything you said has been overly talked in this forum - too many times, and no one ever said it wasn't true haha
personally, I like Namie's objectiveness and honest about her career - including the reason why she has stopped doing tv shows and MCs. Namie is a product, a brand, and a successful one. that's what we all should be happy about, though. she has managed to maintain herself relevant for a whole 25 years. she has adapted pretty well to the mainstream, whatever "era" she was on (even though for a sole album she wasn't as successful, it had more to do with her personal life than her music, really) - and since you mentioned Ayumi: she couldn't adapt her music as successfully. that's how music industry works and I'm sure you'll understand one day that most pop acts are products. and products usually have an expiration date. some fade until no one knows about them. on the other hand, some just choose to leave the stage in a grand way. Namie, for one, is in the second group. actually, everything you said sounded so naive haha like when I was 14 and used to attack whoever bashed Britney Spears because she wasn't a true artist lmao |
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#248
1st February 2018, 08:04 PM
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And Ayu never tried to adapt her music really, as she said, she does what she likes.
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Last edited by Katsuyuki012; 1st February 2018 at 08:09 PM. |
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#249
1st February 2018, 08:30 PM
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are you 15? D: thought you were like my age? haha anyway, it's sad that you won't listen to her songs because of her personality. she didn't commit any crime lol
I prefer not to link personalities with their jobs in music, except if they did anything outrageous (being homofobic, racist, rapist and stuff), but that's me haha |
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#250
1st February 2018, 08:32 PM
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Someone wants a cookie it seems lol
Don't judge namie by ayu's standards. Even tho they have their similarities, they never had the same objective in their careers to begin with. namie never wanted to share her struggles and pain with the public, and she did stick to that, and succeded. ayu wanted to, did that, and also succeded. To each their own. You have all rights not to like namie, but don't try to put her in ayu's shoes. Plus you thinking of ayu as a non-pop-person but an ~artist~ just shows up how naive you are. Yeah, her music IS more passional and personal and blah, but at the end of the day she also did stuff to please her public and grasp popularity, and that's what everyone in the pop scene does, that's not a sin, as long as you're honest with the image you want to show and the one you are actually showing. Last edited by Gustavopc; 1st February 2018 at 08:38 PM. |
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#251
1st February 2018, 08:58 PM
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^if you read carefully you would've seen that I know ayu was produced too. She definitely was but i wouldn't say she is nowadays
+ It's not about this whole artist / performer thing tbh. I knew Namie isn't an artist. For me it was more about all the things Namie said and her attitude.
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Last edited by Katsuyuki012; 1st February 2018 at 09:03 PM. |
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#252
1st February 2018, 09:11 PM
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 I remember when someone in this forum called her "avant-garde"  . Or how she takes more risks than Koda or Ayumi... by doing electropop That was a nice read Katsuyuki-kun! Last edited by Cahz-; 1st February 2018 at 09:13 PM. |
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#253
1st February 2018, 09:19 PM
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With any celebrity, you'll never really know their heart 100% - but with Namie, I feel she's very guarded. I think she gave some insight in these interviews, and some of it less than flattering as you mentioned, but I also guarantee that there was a LOT more going on behind the scenes that is unknown or rumored only.
Past that, I think Namie's goal in fame has almost always been to enjoy herself, and to make other people happy. Unlike others, I don't think it was ever her goal to have a deep connection with her fans - and I think that is why she was so moved by certain moments, like Kouhaku - because she never sought out that kind of connection. And through various times in her career, when she was not enjoying herself, that made her want to stop. Is it alarming just how often she thought about retiring - yes, kind of. But, at the same time, in the scope of the Japanese music scene that would not have been unnatural. Many idols retire by the time they turn 25 and are "too old." I'm sure as her popularity has changed over the years (good and bad), there have also been stresses behind the scenes with her label, management, etc. that have contributed to that. And finally, in a lot of ways, Namie is also VERY Japanese. She had a period of rebellion when her popularity fell, when she did Suite Chic, and even Style & Queen of Hip-pop. But over the years, she's tried to erase a lot of that - removing her tattoos, toning down her image to be more girly, etc. I think she has some more traditional values in terms of what she thinks her life should hold, or how she should live it. But she's a very private person, and I believe she holds a lot inside and has never felt like she wanted to or should share that externally. So I can understand if you feel disillusioned, but I also don't exactly agree with your interpretation. I think if you put her in a Japanese context, it's much more understandable. If you go back to the Ayu comparison, without dwelling on it, Ayu is very non-Japanese in a lot of ways - it was the source of her major popularity earlier in her career, and what continues to hurt her now. So it's not a fair comparison in a lot of different ways. |
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#254
1st February 2018, 09:35 PM
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Namie has always been a "product" of the music industry and I think everyone knew that. I know I personally never expected art from Namie. Because she is not that kind of musical act. She was a TK girl. His creation pretty much. But I don't think Namie is heartless or souless. I think she still cared about the fans and making music that she enjoyed and also dancing of course. I didn't get any negative feelings from the interview or see her as a victim of anything. But I could see how a person could be turned off by Namie's approach to her music career. I thought everyone knew that Namie was more of an entertainer than a musical artist.
When it comes to pop stars, most of them are similar to Namie. They want a career in the entertainment industry and work for record companies. People like Ayu and Utada are special cases, not the norm. That's why Ayu had to fight to gain more creative control over her music career. She was working with a mainstream music company like Avex, where making a profit is a priority, not taking creative risks like Ayu wanted. I don't think you will be bashed.  I think everybody generally has already been aware of what you're saying anyway. |
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#255
1st February 2018, 09:43 PM
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The problem is most of you only focus on the performer thing and as I stated before; that I knew and it didn't surprise me nor is it a problem. Much worse I found things like her excuse for not attending music shows, constantly thinking of retirement and so on... Don't want to over-repeat it either..
I just don't buy her enjoying it so much when she wanted to retire all the time..
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Last edited by Katsuyuki012; 1st February 2018 at 10:45 PM. |
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#256
1st February 2018, 09:52 PM
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^ I can see what you're saying, and obviously you're entitled to your own opinion on it. But I think one way that you could choose to look at it is - she wanted to perform, and loved to perform. She also wanted to be famous for performing and have that lead to success. What she didn't want, and what made her unhappy, was all of the expectation around what that fame and success encompasses.
Whereas most stars are personalities, I don't think she ever wanted that. She didn't want to be judged for who she was or how she acted, she just wanted to be judged for her performance alone and to keep the rest to herself. It's definitely a very abnormal approach, but I don't think it was disingenuous either. |
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#258
1st February 2018, 10:11 PM
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I think voltron explained it really well.
I know it may make Namie look disingenuous when she expresses that she has considered retiring multiple times over the years but is that really that abnormal? Namie has had ups and downs in her career. When something gets difficult, quitting can seem like a viable choice. Plus she was very aware of how the business works. When she started to lose her popularity, she was thinking, I guess that's it my career is over. But instead of giving up a career that she enjoyed, she decided to stick to it. Because of her diligence, she found success again and revived her career. I believe that rekindled her passion for performing. So she kept going for a few more years. But now that she is entering her middle age and 25th anniversary she has decided that she is ready to move on. "Finally I can stop dreaming". She realized her dream. I also think it is understandable that she delayed her retirement until now because she wanted to end her successful career in a specific and special way. I bet there are so many popular singers who think about quitting all the time, for one reason or another. They just aren't as honest as Namie is about it. I don't think that considering the option to give up on something makes someone fake. Last edited by EndOfTheWorld; 1st February 2018 at 10:14 PM. |
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#259
1st February 2018, 10:54 PM
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I just don't believe this whole thing with her loving to perform, maybe she liked it but if she really loved singing and dancing her dream wouldn't be to retire (yet with a bang) and she definitely wouldn't retire at such young age. Her dream would be to do it as long as she could and that's not the case as we know. Maybe she liked it, but I wouldn't say it's love.
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#260
1st February 2018, 11:09 PM
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