They forgot ayumi......

[alternarist]

I have talked about "idols" with a friend of mine who is a fan of Arashi. She said that Arashi is an idol because most of them act in dramas, movies, have their own variety shows and what's more is that they are out to entertain their fans by doing weird things like cross dressing or eating weird stuff in their shows.

ayu doesnt do all of that. I agree with what Andrenekoi said. Ayu acted and modeled when she was a teenager and not when she became a singer. Ayuready is now defunct.

I guess anything before 1998 can be nullified? haha..

[ureal777]

Ayu is muchx1000 more than an idol.

[SunshineSlayer]

Originally Posted by bulmasman

I'm just glad to see Nakamori Akina in there at number 3

but no, Ayu's not an idol singer and never has been

Me too. I never really think of Akina and Momoe as "Idols", but technically they are.

As for the "what qualifies someone to be an idol discussion." In general, idols do not write their own music (although there are some exceptions) and are well known in general, not just well known for being singers. They are known for their personalities, tv shows, movies, stage plays, photo books etc, in addition to music. Music is just one aspect of their career and not necessarily the main feature.

I'm surprised to see SPEED up that high on the list though because outside of their music, as far as I can recall, they didn't do much in the way of tv shows, movies etc. I also find it a bit baffling that they have Kahala Tomomi and Suzuki Ami on the list but not Namie Amuro (who had higher sales.)

Originally Posted by InoriNoUta

Thankfully, this is something Ayu SHOULDN'T be listed on.

I don't know why it would be considered insulting; all the people on the list are extremely hard workers that are actually pretty talented (some extremely so) in some aspect be it singing or acting, hosting etc. Being considered a top idol in Japan is not something to be ashamed of.

[emi♡]

Yeah...like everyone said. Ayu is not an idol.

She's had idol days...but they don't really count for anything now...and considering she wasnt like...famous back then...no one pays attention lol

Yeah...Ayu doesn't even like...seem like an idol lol idk in my head, it's like, here's an idol, and here's Ayu....and...very very different.


I don't think being an idol is necessarily a bad thing...I mean, they're entertainers, that's their profession, and believe it or not, not everyone can do it...I just think...people would see it as insulting for Ayu because of how into her music she is and whatever...and that's understandable...somehow...idk

whatever, she's not the same lol

[Andrenekoi]

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

I also find it a bit baffling that they have Kahala Tomomi and Suzuki Ami on the list but not Namie Amuro (who had higher sales.)

I missed Namie on the list too... I don't think what she does right now can be considered, but when she was with TK, she was an idol too...

[njanjayrp]

Originally Posted by AyUmIXx

I think ayu is an idol as well as artist too..
so actually, i wish i could see her up there on the list..

I think you're also missing a point As andrenekoi said, being an "idol" is a profession and not whether someone is idolizing you or not. I am glad she isn't on that list as idols generally are a passing trend. I don't think there is anything insulting about being on the list though ^^

[Sandy]

Originally Posted by Midori-chan

Ayu was an idol...once, long, long, loooo~~ng time ago!
"Morning Musume", "AKB48", all those JE groups and so on are counted as idols, but not Ayu!

I agree on this one. Long time ago, and not a very successful one. And I doubt if even that would be considered as being an "idol" if you compare her back then to idols right now.

[SunshineSlayer]

What Ayu was doing back then is the very definition of an idol. But Avex did everything they could to bury that and make her an "artist." Still surprised that somehow Namie isnt on the list though.

njanjayrp: I do not know if I agree that they are "passing trends". Some are and time still has to tell for people like AKB, but for the most part, the people on the list have been around a very long time and are considered famous and/or legendary to this day.

[Andrenekoi]

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

What Ayu was doing back then is the very definition of an idol. But Avex did everything they could to bury that and make her an "artist." Still surprised that somehow Namie isnt on the list though.

njanjayrp: I do not know if I agree that they are "passing trends". Some are and time still has to tell for people like AKB, but for the most part, the people on the list have been around a very long time and are considered famous and/or legendary to this day.

^This... I'm no expert, but at least those I know are legendary in Japan's story:

Pink Lady, Yamaguchi Momoe, Nakamori Akina, Matsuda Seiko and SMAP

[bluegie]

I think, I would consider ayu as an idol in her early career (pre-Ma era). Of course if the definition of idol (in Japan) = profession, then she wasn't really an idol even in her early days. At that time she has already begun controlling her career with a certain degree. I believe that being an idol in Japan, you just don't have the right/permission for that.

And.. Momoe Yamaguchi should be an idol as well (she sang, she acted in both dramas and movies)... Then somehow she started controlling her music career (like the type of music she wanna sing, etc), so was she an idol after that transition? Btw I consider her as the most legendary female artist in the Showa era.

[SunshineSlayer]

Yeah, the idol definition is actually quite subjective so its hard to pin down who exactly always falls under the definition or not because their definitely are exceptions. Momoe Yamaguchi is known as an idol even though as pointed out, in her later career she had more control over her music and image and Kinki Kids are on the list even though they do write a good bit of their own material.

@Andrenekoi: Also Checkers, Candies, Nakayama Miho, Shizuka Kudo, Hikaru Genji; honestly just about everyone on the list except for the newest groups. All of those people had long careers and many, many hits. Honestly I dont think Idols in Japan have ever been a passing trend, but an ingrained part of the culture.

[C+R+E+AYUMI]

Originally Posted by DA1SUK1DAY01691

See, the funny thing, I don't see SPEED as idols;

LOL!!!

[Andrenekoi]

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

@Andrenekoi: Also Checkers, Candies, Nakayama Miho, Shizuka Kudo, Hikaru Genji; honestly just about everyone on the list except for the newest groups. All of those people had long careers and many, many hits. Honestly I dont think Idols in Japan have ever been a passing trend, but an ingrained part of the culture.

I guess @njanjayrp meant that idols career tend to be short lived, and that their fame is a passing trend... What isn't all wrong, but also works for jpop singers/band... Or even worst, work for most celebrities anywhere in the world... Once u peaked, u tend to be forgoten If u r not good enough...

[njanjayrp]

^ yeah that's what I meant, but you're right.

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

njanjayrp: I do not know if I agree that they are "passing trends". Some are and time still has to tell for people like AKB, but for the most part, the people on the list have been around a very long time and are considered famous and/or legendary to this day.

While some of them are legends that doesn't make them relevant on today's market. That's what I was referring to. None of them will ever stay popular forever which makes them a passing trend in a way. Though when I think about it, there is hardly anyone who'll stay relevant forever so yeah I guess you're right.

Originally Posted by Andrenekoi

^This... I'm no expert, but at least those I know are legendary in Japan's story:

Pink Lady, Yamaguchi Momoe, Nakamori Akina, Matsuda Seiko and SMAP

There were also Matsutoya Yumi and Takeuchi Mariya, but the latter one wasn't an idol as far as I know plus she still sells tons.

[Andrenekoi]

Originally Posted by njanjayrp

^ yeah that's what I meant, but you're right.



While some of them are legends that doesn't make them relevant on today's market. That's what I was referring to. None of them will ever stay popular forever which makes them a passing trend in a way. Though when I think about it, there is hardly anyone who'll stay relevant forever so yeah I guess you're right.



There were also Matsutoya Yumi and Takeuchi Mariya, but the latter one wasn't an idol as far as I know plus she still sells tons.

Well, both are regarded as great musicians... Yumi composed some of the biggest jpop hits ever recorded (like Seiko's Akai sweet pea and Rock n Rouge) and even has an album among the 100 japanese best according to Rolling Stone magazine (her album is at 11°, btw)

[gothicayu]

Originally Posted by Andrenekoi

From wikipedia:


If i got it right, Idols are multimidia celebrities whose image and life style has a bigger impact than their works...
Maybe they considered that Ayu's career is music focused instead of multimedia

i think so too . i dont think it was a mistake i just think ayu concentrate more on her music

[Bigtop]

Ayu's not an idol - she's more of a "purebred singer"...

[Mami-chan]

Originally Posted by njanjayrp

While some of them are legends that doesn't make them relevant on today's market. That's what I was referring to. None of them will ever stay popular forever which makes them a passing trend in a way. Though when I think about it, there is hardly anyone who'll stay relevant forever so yeah I guess you're right.

You're right. but that's the same for artists too. People like Glay, L'Arc~en~Ciel and many others are legends in Japan but now they don't sell well as several years ago. That doesn't mean they're not famous anymore. And same is for idol.
Moreover, idol are usually more appreciated than artists in Japan ^^; probably because they do catchy songs and can be found everywhere, people can enjoy them in their tv programs etc...

ah lol, you were saying the same XD

[Miidoriness]

Well... Maybe she is NOT an idol... But she's a LEGEND!!! Don't worry~ she's too good to be on that list LOL XD jk...