Lets vent about ayu?/why did your fandom decrease

[& + H]

I don't understand, if your interest of ayu hasn't decreased why are you commenting here?
is a vent thread so comment somewhere else.


I think her music went downhill after next level. not just her music, her pv's, her magazine shoots.
although now and then she comes up with an amazing song.

[Yumsushi]

Originally Posted by Andrenekoi

1. Touring is the MOST EXAUSTING part of a musician life. Don't believe me? You can read this from any musician who constantly tours. Traveling by itself is exausting, doing that weekly having to care about a major show including performances, reharshals, props, outfits and making it work every time? Far harder than recording music or PV. 2013 tour had less dates than 2011 and 2012, but more than most soloist, and it probably had more to do with the public's lack of interest after years of massive (by jpop standarts) touring than with her own lack of interest. 2014 pretty much has a new aproach to her tours.

2. You can't know someone based on manufaturated pop music and staged interviews. Almost everything we "know" about Ayumi or any other public figure is based on whatever they want us to know and most of the time we have nothing but a calculated "glimpse of personalities" for the sake of a public image decided by a marketing team.

3. Be my guest.

Its so funny how you brought up touring as an indicator that she cares but couldn't back it up with anything except that it is exhausting. So what if she tours more often? Sure its exhausting but its the only way for her to make money nowadays. And if what you say about us not knowing anything about real life Ayumi, then there is no evidence to support anything you said about her reason for touring either.

Really, before you start throwing insults you should work on your reading comprehension.

[marcoba]

Many of the reasons people give here of why they are not as passionate fans of Ayu as they were, are so superficial! XD. It's like you discover she is a human been with ups and downs and that's why you don't like her as much as before. Also is kind of sad, but makes me actually appreciate her even more that before.
Maybe is because I understand life is never perfect, or because I started to like her back in 2012. So many of her problems with life and love are normal to me, it's life after all .

[rikku1994]

Most of the people here are frustrated, but tbh... I'm kinda happy for her as of the moment.

Been a fan of her for 12 years, and I've always felt that she was so trapped with the media, her fans, her job? As if she was never able to move freely. I mean, during 2002, everything she does becomes so sensationalized by the media and her fans. She was praised 24/7... Everyone was soooo used to her singing songs based on loneliness and hopelessness. Everyone was so used to her being so extravagant.

Her voice, well I already knew that her voice will deteriorate (by the way how she sings)... But I've noticed that she was more... err... relaxed? And she seems happier to be in L.A.

The public, even her fans started losing interest with her, some even became haters. Comments like "WTF is she doing with her life!?", "she's such a diva", "she's washed up" and etc. became the usual comments towards her lately. Prolly because she's not the same person back in her prime. Have you seen the other comments? Most of the people here still has that old image of her in their mind, and they can't really move on and accept the fact that she's not the same person back in 2001...

You could really tell that she had enough, she had less public appearances, she's not release-whoring the same way she did before. She needs a break, but it seems that she doesn't know how? And I guess L.A. is that escape route as of the moment...

[primavera♥]

Originally Posted by emi♡

Yeah I don't really believe that she doesn't care. I think she cares a lot, but I don't think it always comes off that way.

I don't think it's bad that her fans have expectations of her. I think it sucks that sometimes people have unreal or delusional expectations, but not all of them are always so. We can talk about the market and all of these things, but at the end of the day, people want things.

That's something that leads people to be discontented when they don't get it. It happens with anything in life. That's when you move on, or take a bit of a back seat and be more careful with your opinions. But of course, some people never do.


To be honest, one of the biggest disappointments in the Ayu fandom is how some of the fans treat each other. I'll never underestimate the value of the fans I've befriended who aren't assholes.

I like what emi says here.

And to be honest, it could be hard to judge how much she truly cared in the first place. Idk. I think people knew ayu in the past less than they think they did but it would be hard to see that depending on how invested they were.

When people don't get exactly what they want, I understand the feeling. But sometimes, all of the ideas and beliefs that stem from that are unreasonable or don't look at the big picture. But whatever. People are people.

[Andrenekoi]

Originally Posted by Yumsushi

Its so funny how you brought up touring as an indicator that she cares but couldn't back it up with anything except that it is exhausting. So what if she tours more often? Sure its exhausting but its the only way for her to make money nowadays. And if what you say about us not knowing anything about real life Ayumi, then there is no evidence to support anything you said about her reason for touring either.

Really, before you start throwing insults you should work on your reading comprehension.

Or maybe you should put your brain to work a little bit

Ayumi doesn't need to work if she doesn't want to, she is rich enough to live twice without needing to make any more money. And even if she didn't tour, her back catalogue is big and notorious enough for her to make money without actually having to do anything... If she wanted she could just do whatever she wanted while the money entered on her bank account, pretty much like Hikki does nowadays.

Instead of doing that, she is touring yearly, and not only that, but having her tours with the most dates (from 2009~2012) and the most physical demanding performances, considering she's actually performs choreography nowadays instead of the begining of her career where she pretty much was on the stage singing and walking around from times to times. She is not making things easier, but harder to her as a performer. How come someone who doesn't need to work anymore to make money is making things harder to her as a performer doesn't care? Sorry, but unless you are biased on the idea that she doesn't care because you don't like what she is doing lately (and that's ok, people can like or dislike whatever they want), that doesn't make sense.

Even if she was just touring because she has a contract forcing her (what isn't THAT unlikely on the jpop industry), why would she add MORE choreography, add MORE theater acting aspects, make her performances MORE physical demanding than they ever were before? Why would she add MORE dates if a 15 dates arena tour (like she did "when she cared") would still be bigger and more profitable than the tours done by most of the other stars?

So, can you explain me that?

[Max_ZZZ]

Originally Posted by tasking

Ayu CDs will run you at LEAST $30 total if you want Japan press. Most of the time for me to afford them at all, I have to buy overseas CD only or used. For the same price or a little more, I can get one of GD's DVDs brand-new with a photobook at the very least. (With the One of a Kind in Seoul DVD, it was a double disc with two photobooks. Not to mention, the packaging is very innovative.) With Ayu, you get no extras unless you pay extra or are TeamAyu, and most of the time the covers are half ass.

Ya side note, I've always wanted ayu to step up her packaging game. K-pop groups kill it with the aesthetics!! but her USB for next level was awesome

[rikku1994]

Originally Posted by Andrenekoi

Or maybe you should put your brain to work a little bit

Ayumi doesn't need to work if she doesn't want to, she is rich enough to live twice without needing to make any more money. And even if she didn't tour, her back catalogue is big and notorious enough for her to make money without actually having to do anything... If she wanted she could just do whatever she wanted while the money entered on her bank account, pretty much like Hikki does nowadays.

Instead of doing that, she is touring yearly, and not only that, but having her tours with the most dates (from 2009~2012) and the most physical demanding performances, considering she's actually performs choreography nowadays instead of the begining of her career where she pretty much was on the stage singing and walking around from times to times. She is not making things easier, but harder to her as a performer. How come someone who doesn't need to work anymore to make money is making things harder to her as a performer doesn't care? Sorry, but unless you are biased on the idea that she doesn't care because you don't like what she is doing lately (and that's ok, people can like or dislike whatever they want), that doesn't make sense.

Even if she was just touring because she has a contract forcing her (what isn't THAT unlikely on the jpop industry), why would she add MORE choreography, add MORE theater acting aspects, make her performances MORE physical demanding than they ever were before? Why would she add MORE dates if a 15 dates arena tour (like she did "when she cared") would still be bigger and more profitable than the tours done by most of the other stars?

So, can you explain me that?

THIS!

[Tom Punks]

Just because you've MADE a lot of money previously doesn't mean you currently HAVE a lot of money or don't want to make more. lol.

[ayumisrael]

I think that his point was that she is working her ass for that money and sometimes even adds to her hardships herself to try make things better even if it's not like that all the time.

You can like what she does or not but she still works hard on these stuff. I'm actually happy she is trying this new showcase and started working with different producers, bringing some changes to what she usually does.

I myself, felt like I sorta got distant from her, sometimes because of the music, sometimes because of her actions, but actually, I find her way more human than she was. Having a rich girl life, and the fact that she shares some of it with the public, just shows how a person can enjoy it (when he/she has it), and a lot decide to call it "diva, stupid, fake" whatever. Not that a lot of people wouldn't do things she does (which I believe) with her money or life, since, she does mistakes humans do, and like we don't want to be judged for our mistakes, she shouldn't as well". So that's how I feel when she does them, as long as it's not too serious and as long she is willing to bring some good music and shows.

Now, asking people who say that her singing deteriorated.
I mean people say it about both her voice and singing.
First of all, if you know that you don't like it anymore so why even try?
second, did it really? I mean, for me, how she sings now (ignoring some TV performances like Feel the love one) is probably her best era of how her voice sounds, and her singing, talking about A BEST TOUR 2013. Now, I'm not deaf but I think that technically she did improve a lot, and as much as I love her classical voice pre 2003, I personally think that how she sounds now is way better than then, less squeeky, more humane. So the question is like, was her singing and vocals really better back in her first years, even though that I agree that these vocals are one of the things she is known for.

There are misses here and there of course, but I never heard anyone with less faults (except for Opera singers), not in Jpop and not in General. There might be better technical singers with better voices of course, but ayu still does IT for me with these. Still.

Like a lot of us in this thread, of course I always wish she would do great music, be more relatable even having a high life style, do more promo, do cool stuff and performances, not combine private life/love with her work making it look like just a promotion, but I think that she is at a point where she does things in her own time and her own way, and it doesn't have to be translated to good or bad.
Also apart from us, the Japanese don't really care for all these stuff, besides wishing for a relatable cute singer (like how ayu used to be) that makes ballads/cute songs and being in cool places having good endorsements (like popular dramas and fashion commercials for example) and they don't really care for anything else.

I think that people that got really distant from her should give her a try from time to time, it's ok not to like a lot of things, but it's also ok to compliment when you do, or at least tell us about the things that still makes you try her stuff, and not because she is ayu and you used to adore her a long time ago.

[emi♡]

Let's throw some fuel around here...

About the touring...a lot of people originally thought that she only did that because of how successful Namie's tour was for Best Fiction. There was all this media about her having 30 show dates and how long it was, and the fact that it was a packed, almost nonstop setlist.

No one had tours that long ever, but now it's almost expected. Namie's tours also still have a million dates lol

[ayumisrael]

Originally Posted by emi♡

Let's throw some fuel around here...

About the touring...a lot of people originally thought that she only did that because of how successful Namie's tour was for Best Fiction. There was all this media about her having 30 show dates and how long it was, and the fact that it was a packed, almost nonstop setlist.

No one had tours that long ever, but now it's almost expected. Namie's tours also still have a million dates lol

I believe it was with NEXT LEVEL/Rock'n'Roll Circus tours but I doubt that ayu was trying to overcome that. We can't prove if yes or not, but that's talking about theories but thinking that ayu made long tours and could do that too, just because of namie is kind of streched. namie has nothing to do with ayu's fans getting distant from ayu =P (though same theme thread for other artists could be interesting as well).

[happiholic★]

Originally Posted by relmy

I think the problem is that her persona from years ago was simply more likeable, that's the wrong word, interesting maybe?... but it wasn't her, we didn't really know anything. Now she can be herself and do what she wants, and she's... kind of boring. Champagne, sunshine, pools and millionaire friends are only interesting for a short while.

So much of Ayu's appeal is being able to relate. So, I guess, her life now kind of breaks the illusion in a way. It makes you realise how crafted everything has been all along.

Really great post!

Also, thinking about it, I think saying Ayu doesnt care anymore is a bit extreme. I think perhaps she is more easily contented? She did say as much in a recent interview, if I recall correctly. Also, someone made a statement about yes-men. I could see that being true. She's been in control of her career for so long, perhaps her staff just leave things up to her all the time.

Also, on the issue of "knowing" Ayu, its a tricky situation. I've always seen fans claim the number one reason they love her is that they feel like they know her through her lyrics, because they are so honest. But, on the other hand, she is a popstar who has a company that needs to profit off of her. We get calculated images of her, what we are allowed to see. So, which is it? Do we know the real Ayu or not?

[emi♡]

Originally Posted by ayumisrael

I believe it was with NEXT LEVEL/Rock'n'Roll Circus tours but I doubt that ayu was trying to overcome that. We can't prove if yes or not, but that's talking about theories but thinking that ayu made long tours and could do that too, just because of namie is kind of streched. namie has nothing to do with ayu's fans getting distant from ayu =P (though same theme thread for other artists could be interesting as well).

Well they were talking about why Ayu had long tours for such a long time lol

The first tour she did it with was right after Namie's. That's why people were making comparisons~ But yeah, doesn't mean, it's correct, just another thing floating around, but it can contribute to fans being a little disgruntled.

Lots of things can. I think sometimes being in the fandom for long periods of time, we can forget about the things that happen at specific times, but for some fans, those small things might be really important. They might have been like, the final straw.

Who knows what people think lol^^

[Andrenekoi]

Originally Posted by emi♡

Well they were talking about why Ayu had long tours for such a long time lol

The first tour she did it with was right after Namie's. That's why people were making comparisons~ But yeah, doesn't mean, it's correct, just another thing floating around, but it can contribute to fans being a little disgruntled.

Lots of things can. I think sometimes being in the fandom for long periods of time, we can forget about the things that happen at specific times, but for some fans, those small things might be really important. They might have been like, the final straw.

Who knows what people think lol^^

Well, live performance is pretty much in lately... Everyone is having more tour dates and some popstars (Beyoncé for example) even toured without having a new album to promote... IMO her recent long tours are just part of the moment pop music is going through. Also having a long tour just for the sake of doing it is a bad idea, as the ticket sales may backfire.

I don't like everything Ayu does and I don't think anyone should... But there's nothing on her that hints she is not into it anymore... NEXT LEVEL, Rock'n'Roll Circus, Love songs, Party Queen and even Love again had she trying new sounds... AT09, AT10, AT11, AT12 and AT13 all demanded a lot more of her as a performer (singing, dancing and acting-wise) than any of her classic concerts... Her singing technique never was better than it is now (as she actually does have singing technique now)... If she still is trying new stuff, still is challenging herself and still is improving, there's no way she doesn't care.

Promotion wise, she is doing exactly what she should be doing after more than a decade of massive super-exposition, and it's not like having tie-ins depends only on her... As the general public loses interest on her, it's natural there's less CMs and theme songs being ordered.

[emi♡]

But I think this thread shows that people disagree with you on what she SHOULD be doing lol

You're saying that people shouldn't feel like she doesn't care, but people still do :/


I don't think that people always take into account that whole "massive super-exposition" that happened in her early career, when it comes to their opinions...but at the same time, as I said in my other post, it's hard, when lots of your other artists are doing all of these things.........and here's Ayu over here, doing (seemingly) the same thing. I mean, that's been a complaint from people for a long time, and it doesn't seem to be going away so quickly.

I don't think it's something you can really combat with logic. It's just how people *feel* and the feelings they get from her. It's too individual. In a thread like this, people get to express those things.

[Sven@.@]

Originally Posted by emi♡

I haven't really read the thread, and whatever.

I'll just repeat something a friend said to me a few years ago when we discussed a few reasons why Ayu is not as great today (in our opinion).

Her music just doesn't resonate with us anymore. Probably because of her age and her values.

But the biggest thing, in my own opinion, I don't feel like her production quality is there anymore. I get the reasons for this, and it's fine. I do my best not to complain about it, because there's no use.

I agree with this sentiment. I've been a fan for a long time now, and I've grown with Ayu but my music tastes have grown APART from the music she is doing now. I don't really care for high pitched cutesy songs, it's not my thing. But if Ayu is happy doing that kind of music, more power to her. But I can't force myself to like a song when I don't like it.

My own preferences are for Ayu's huskier, rougher around the edges vocals and I think it's kind of a pity that she's not encouraged to sing that way. It could be easier on her, because the vocals she's doing now, they sound like straining to get the note. And musically it's not appealing to me.

I still listen to Ayu's music, but it stops at Party Queen and Love Songs. I just could not get into those albums and I really did give them a couple of listens. Recently, I liked "Wake Me Up" but that was about it---because it sounded like a strong song, musically and thematically.

Do I feel distant from Ayu? In a way yes, because I'm not into the newer material. I want to be pleasantly surprised with this new showcase, because she'll always be one of my favorite artists.

I said in a thread a while ago that I wanted her to have a break and she seems to be releasing music at a leisurely pace (good for her!).

I will say, I do think she's doing this weird thing of trying to take a break and still be a celebrity at the same time (don't know if she's obligated to or not) but the results make a lot of her creative output seem....uninspired at best. I mean, the video for "Feel the love," regardless of anything is a bad music video. She's gotten stuck in this creative rut where everything is centered on one idea, and that can get boring. I know that Avex doesn't care as long as she makes money and delivers a product, but hopefully this showcase will be in the right direction. I don't know though, because I think the *~era~* of Ayu doing elaborate and out there visuals is pretty much in the past because, during those times she was a workaholic and committed to that. I think now she wants to relax and it shows in her work. It's not a terrible thing but, yeah, as a fan of her work, I can't just jump for joy when I see the same thing over and over again.

[Andrenekoi]

Originally Posted by emi♡

But I think this thread shows that people disagree with you on what she SHOULD be doing lol

You're saying that people shouldn't feel like she doesn't care, but people still do :/


I don't think that people always take into account that whole "massive super-exposition" that happened in her early career, when it comes to their opinions...but at the same time, as I said in my other post, it's hard, when lots of your other artists are doing all of these things.........and here's Ayu over here, doing (seemingly) the same thing. I mean, that's been a complaint from people for a long time, and it doesn't seem to be going away so quickly.

I don't think it's something you can really combat with logic. It's just how people *feel* and the feelings they get from her. It's too individual. In a thread like this, people get to express those things.

I'm saying that from a marketing/advertising point of view, I could care less about how her fandom believe she should be promoting.

Even the lack of tie-ins and CMs make it clear the general public still is sick of her, and if the general public is sick of her shoving her on everyone's throats is not a good thing to do... While she can't have massive promotion she is focusing on her usual targets (hardcore fanbase, gyaru) and slowly reaching new space by associating her name with some less mainstream stuff (drama for people over 40's, having her song being the theme of the Pride Parade, tie-ins with movies that are less comercial and more artistic like Helter Skelter and Bhuda 2, etc.)

[channy]

Originally Posted by Andrenekoi

You can't know someone based on manufaturated pop music and staged interviews. Almost everything we "know" about Ayumi or any other public figure is based on whatever they want us to know and most of the time we have nothing but a calculated "glimpse of personalities" for the sake of a public image decided by a marketing team.

Yea, I always wonder why people would cite interviews. They feel generally fake and constructed. Ayu never happened to talk about her life like a "normal" person. She's obviously bound to please. What if she does not like pop music at all? Perhaps she can't even stand make-up or expensive luxury brands? Even if so, would she dare to state these opinions? Probably not.

Fans don't want her to be real. If she were to be her real self, she would be as boring as everyone else.

[Andrenekoi]

Originally Posted by channy

Yea, I always wonder why people would cite interviews. They feel generally fake and constructed. Ayu never happened to talk about her life like a "normal" person. She's obviously bound to please. What if she does not like pop music at all? Perhaps she can't even stand make-up or expensive luxury brands? Even if so, would she dare to state these opinions? Probably not.

Fans don't want her to be real. If she were to be her real self, she would be as boring as everyone else.

I do believe her A Song for XX interviews before she was a top-tier popstar were pretty sincere, and I do think her interviews from last year and this year are pretty sincere too... But still, she is pretty reserved about of her personal life or opinions most of the time.