[News] R.I.P Michael Jackson died today

[luna7996]

Originally Posted by Amrai-chan

On CNN after that one interview they showed that one reporter going up to Joe to clarify some things. If I heard right Joe said something like "Some people cry with tears but I'm crying inside outside I'm strong." Or something like that. It probably hasn't hit him yet. I know when someone I love had died the next day I had been smiling and laughing but deep down...it didn't really hit me until the funeral maybe it's that way with him.

He comes from a time where showing emotion is a sign of weakness.

Joe isn't behaving any differently than he always has. All of the siblings have said Joe is unemotional and distant. That is why they call him Joseph instead of dad or father.

The record label promotion was a bit odd though but grief affects people in different ways and sometimes people just start talking about differnt things.

Someone else should speak for the family though because it doesn't look good to people.

And I wish I could give Janet a hug. Poor dear. Michael and her were very close.

You made a very good point. Never tought of it that way. I already had him on my black list even without seeing things from his point of view. Shame on me....

Now that I think about it is quite true how some people dont react to death quite as fast as others. When my neighbor's mom died my neighbor look fine.Totally calm.I tought that it was very strange but when the medics enter the room of the house to pick the body and take her away my neighbor went into a crying fit and started to cry beggin to the medic to please not take her mother away.It was quite scary and sad.

My mother explain how sometime you see the body and you keep telling yourself...''she is just sleping,she is just sleeping'' and you dont quite wrasp the concept that she is not going to wake up until you see them take her away or until the funeral.

[SunshineSlayer]

Well, the doctor has now spoken at least through his attorney, saying that the bed was a firm bed (this excuse is only valid if the bed is wood with no cushion!) and then even further goes on to say that he put one hand under Michael's back and then administered CPR with his other hand. (I'm sorry but, is he trying to be funny or something?) And that also this went on for about 30 minutes before calling an ambulance. This just screams negligence to me and often times these house doctors, especially in Hollywood, are little more than enablers with a license - even CPR laymen can tell that this was a botched job let alone various health care professionals that have been weighing in with their opinions. It seems as though this probably could have been prevented, or at least post poned had CPR not been given incorrectly for 30minutes before even calling the ambulance.

[Amrai-chan]

^ Also Michael had a slight pulse.

Yeah words can not begin to describe...

Also I heard the attorney say (then again I could have heard wrong since I'm so agh over the whole thing right now) That the reason that the 'doctor' did not call 911 was becausee he did not know the address of the place so he went to find the cook, while the cook called a bodygarud who then called the ambulence.

Which then it's like if that's the case why couldn't you have called while looking for someone who knew the address.

How are you going to be the 'doctor' for Michael Jackson and not know his address?

I mean... just...

He may not be fully responsible in this but he is some at the least. Or maybe he is fully responsible.

@ panda♥ Yeah. It's said the bond between siblings is very strong, one of a kind thing. I can't imagine how she must feel but she's strong, since she manged to get to the BET awards if only for a few seconds...she was trying not to cry...

@ luna7996 It's really strange how the mind handles things sometimes...

This is hard. At least 12 fans have commited suicde over this. Michael would not have wanted this. Rev. Jesse Jackson and Michael's friend Teddy Riley have left messages with the fans over this. It was kind of kept quiet in the fan circle because of how the media is but it seems Gary spoke out about it here.

I never thought I would have to convice various people who are like extended family to me not to do anything stupid. Just a little while ago I tried to convice someone not to do anything...I hope I got to them somehow.

[Ayumi27]

Apparently, these pics have been taken during dress rehearsal of This is It at Staples Center the night before... He looked strong & healthy

[panda♥]

Michael looked very happy in those rehearsal pics.

I think "the doctor not knowing the address" is an absolutely ridiculous excuse for irresponsibility. I'm sure if he would have just said "The house Michael Jackson is staying in in Hombly Hills" they'd know what he was talking about. Don't the medics know where all of the VIPs stay? And couldn't they have tracked the call to the location?

I'm almost positive that if Michael was given CPR on the GROUND and if the ambulance was called IMMEDIATELY he would still be alive. I think the doctor should have been monitoring him after he injected the Demerol anyway. It makes me so mad knowing that if 2 of those mistakes were avoided, Michael would still be alive right now. He'd be in the hospital, but he'd still be alive.

At the same time, I'm sure Michael is in a much better place. He doesn't have to worry about the stress of the media or anything. He's free from everything and I'm sure he's alot happier. He probably doesn't want us to be sad, but he's happy now and that's all that matters.

[milky_way]

I just bought the Commemorative Time magazine and I plan on getting the one from USA Today too. I'm still bummed out about this

[Amrai-chan]

Yeah, the fact he doesn't have to stress about the media or anything is a comfort.

Regarding the rehersal pictures....

Epic I tell you, Epic.

Kenny Ortega is working towrds getting the rehersals released...

As he said from his Twitter

The TII Team is deeply grieving the loss of our dear Michael. Our hearts go out to Michaels Children, Family and Fans around the world. LOVE As we close our eyes on this sad day, DREAM, BELIEVE, THIS IS NOT IT. In time, we will celebrate and honor his vision with you all.

You are not alone in the desire to see Michael celebrated with a Tribute that honors his final work TII We are working to make that real.

[ImpactBreaker]

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

Well, the doctor has now spoken at least through his attorney, saying that the bed was a firm bed (this excuse is only valid if the bed is wood with no cushion!)

I haven't really seem the interview with the attorney, however, chest compressions can be performed efficiently on a bed, and it doesn't need to be 100% hard like a floor is in order for it to work. I can perform CPR on my bed just fine. It's possible for the health professional doing the proper techinique to know if what they're doing is efficient, specially if the patient is thin (which michael surely was) because you can see and feel the sternum diving deep into the chest while doing the compressions. In order for what I'm saying not to sound to vague, here's the abstract of an study showing no technical ifference in chest compressions done on a hospital bed (which is relatively soft) without a board under, and the ones done on the floor (a ahrd surface) by health professionals: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19388894. If you are trained and know how to perform the proper technique, it doesn't really matter if you are on a softer surface. I'm sure Michael didn't have a water jelly mattress or an elastic bed, or anything that would make it completely effortless to do the maneuver, anyways, so that statement doesn't invalidate his affirmation that the bed offered a firm surface, nor I believe the outcome would have changed had MJ received chest compressions on the floor surface. That's a technical tidbit that people will be pulling in order to blame whoever they can.

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

and then even further goes on to say that he put one hand under Michael's back and then administered CPR with his other hand. (I'm sorry but, is he trying to be funny or something?)

On the other hand this sounds a little bizarre. I haven't heard of this technique for doing CPR. I'm used to chest compressions with both hands followed by mouth-to-mouth breaths or the use of respiratory devices. I wonder if he'll explain this better or if his attorney just got lost in expalining the procedure that was done.

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

And that also this went on for about 30 minutes before calling an ambulance. This just screams negligence to me and often times these house doctors, especially in Hollywood, are little more than enablers with a license - even CPR laymen can tell that this was a botched job let alone various health care professionals that have been weighing in with their opinions. It seems as though this probably could have been prevented, or at least post poned had CPR not been given incorrectly for 30minutes before even calling the ambulance.

Once you start CPR you can't stop it to do something outside form the CPR standards. If he were to stop chest compressions in order to make a phone call, he'd be wasting time. I wonder about the other people in the house, like weren't there other employees around? They could have called the ambulance in the mean time.

It's really hard to put the blame on his death on the quality of assitance. Do you guys know how long was michael in respiratory arrest the moment he was found like that by someone or his doctor? If he was on an arrest for a couple of minutes when he was found, not even the best CPR would save him if anoxya and hypoperfusion had already caused damaged enugh damage to the brain, heart and other organs. Maybe some of those questions could becme a little less blurry by an autopsy and police enquiry, like estimating the exact time of his death (I mean you can try CPR on a person who's found dead but that doesn't mean CPR will be effective). If we take the hypothesis that he had a demerol overdosis, demerol kills by causing a respiratory arrest. Once the person stops breathing for a longer time, hypoxia comes and a cardiac arrest is the one of its consequences, generally as a pulseless heart activity or an asystole. asystole has a really poor prognosis, specially if the duration of the event has already taking a long time before CPR was administrated in cases in which the cuase was potentially reversible. While these kinds of heart arrests can genrally be reverted, the outcome is generally not good, and I bleieve Michael Jackson had one of those rather the ventricular fibrillation which can be promptly reverted by deffibrilation with a cardioversor.

Originally Posted by Amrai-chan

^ Also Michael had a slight pulse.

Where did you read that? If you have a central pulse, you're not on cardiac arrest, therefore, chest compressions are not indicated. If the person was pulseless but during CPR, a pulse is palpable, it shows the CPR is being relativelly efficient. If, after pausing for a few seconds the chest compressions in order to check for pulses, a central pulse is palpable, the cardiac arrest has been reverted, and chest compressions can be stopped.



About not knowing the adress, well, if the doctor or michael himself had designated people specifically for taking the doctor over his home, I don't really see why would it be absolutely necessary for the doctor himself to have the exact address memorized.

Was it confirmed that the last demrol injection was administered by the doctor though? I agree that if he did it, he should've had monitored Michael. However, are we really sure that Michael didn't really inject himself with it or osmething else before dying? I think we need ;wmore clues before making accusations. With more clues maybe it might become more clear that proper assistance was not given or that the doctors actions ultimately led to MJ's death, but that's really too premature too assume imo.

[kendelle]

Originally Posted by panda♥

Michael looked very happy in those rehearsal pics.

I think "the doctor not knowing the address" is an absolutely ridiculous excuse for irresponsibility. I'm sure if he would have just said "The house Michael Jackson is staying in in Hombly Hills" they'd know what he was talking about. Don't the medics know where all of the VIPs stay? And couldn't they have tracked the call to the location?

In Australia celebrities & the high-profile people (ie politicians, large business owners like Coles and Woolworths etc) have "panic buttons" all through out their houses. In case of emergency they simply press the button and the police are out there in minutes. It's a priority system for people in the public eye in case a person breaks in or there's a stalker outside. They would DEFINITELY have something similar in other countries.

It looks like conspiracy theorists have decided that he didn't die after all and have posted a bunch of blurred pics claiming they're MJ on Monday, escaping overseas and going to Mexico. We have Elvis Mark II

I was always going to buy his albums that I liked when I was younger (we only have cassette tapes! xD) but I feel like a sheep going to get them now I'll wait again...I wonder when the 100+ unreleased songs he's recorded will start to leak?

[SunshineSlayer]

^ There is no doubt though that the doctors behavior is questionable to say the least. Why disappear after the fact and immediately hire a criminal attorney even though the police had said he wasn't a suspect. Not calling 911 immediately makes absolutely no sense, I doubt he was the only person there (for sure he wasn't since someone else made the 911 call and the caller uses the word "they"), and if he was you still always call 911 before you start CPR - it doesn't matter how much CPR you do if no ambulence is on the way. If he can somehow manage the feat of performing CPR with one hand, he can certainly do it with 2 hands while talking on the phone supported by his shoulder. That would actually make more sense than anything he has claimed. Also this guy was supposed to be a cardiologist (but he was not board certified, there's a major red flag right there) but yet he apparently didn't know how to properly run a heart related code? Nor did he have a crash cart with any of the materials that are actually necessary in emergency situations. Why hire a cardiologist in the first place then?

I actually asked my mother about the hospital beds thing (she has been a nurse for 25+ years) and she confirmed that CPR should never be given on a bed - doesn't matter how firm it is, especially when the person could be moved to the floor. Hospital beds are firmer than most beds, yet nurses/doctors are still required to put a backboard underneath a patient when giving CPR. You can see the same opinion from several other doctors and nurses.

And yeah, the "one handed CPR" trick - I can't believe his lawyer is going with that as a defense it just seems like a desperate move to try to explain away the CPR being performed on a bed. If CPR on a bed is inefficient, one handed CPR is pretty much impossible.

Not knowing the address doesn't matter either since when you call 911, the police can get your address almost immediately. Besides that, it is pretty weird that he didn't know the address of the place that he himself was living at.

And then, I don't know how "official" to consider this yet, but according to a few sources by the time that paramedics arrived, it was obvious Jackson was dead and had been so for a while. They wanted to call the coroner, yet the doctor insisted that they run a full code.

[ImpactBreaker]

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

^ There is no doubt though that the doctors behavior is questionable to say the least. Why disappear after the fact and immediately hire a criminal attorney even though the police had said he wasn't a suspect. Not calling 911 immediately makes absolutely no sense, I doubt he was the only person there (for sure he wasn't since someone else made the 911 call and the caller uses the word "they"), and if he was you still always call 911 before you start CPR - it doesn't matter how much CPR you do if no ambulence is on the way.

Well, I don't deny his behavior was questionable. However, with the way the media and people try to find small tidbits to place a heavy burden over anything, I do believe it is more prudent for him to be very cautious on what is going to be said, because since he was one of the last people that were around michael and the fact he was also a doctor do surely have a heavy implication over this issue. The last sentence is not true. If there's more than one person in a place and one of them knows advanced life support techniques, this person should never delay the CPR in order to do something else (calling, etc). They should start CPR an yell for somebody else to call the ambulance. I will actually say something opposite from what you stated: it doesn't really matter if any ambulance is on its way if the person's brain and heart have already been fully damaged by the lack of oxygenation/perfusion after a few minutes of a cardiac arrest in which CPR was neglected just because the person was calling 911 to give instructions. Unless neither of them didn't know what to do, and were to receive CPR instructions through the phone. He was a doctor so receiving instrucitons to perform CPR was theoretically not to be necessary lol. He shouldn't really stop CPR in order to call the ambulance. I'm sure michael had other people at home to do that.

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

If he can somehow manage the feat of performing CPR with one hand, he can certainly do it with 2 hands while talking on the phone supported by his shoulder. That would actually make more sense than anything he has claimed. Also this guy was supposed to be a cardiologist (but he was not board certified, there's a major red flag right there) but yet he apparently didn't know how to properly run a heart related code? Nor did he have a crash cart with any of the materials that are actually necessary in emergency situations. Why hire a cardiologist in the first place then?

There's a msiconception here. Cardiologists don't walk with medication charts. Also, hiring a cardiologist doesn't mean the cardiologist will necessarily have to pay a visit with a mobile ICU unit. That's really unreal to think at the least. If Mike's condition was so bad that a doctor would have to pay a visit like that, he would have to have been in a hospital instead. It makes no sense to be on a house with no medical team to help and to be carrying advanced support medications just for the sake of that-who's going to venopuncture, break vials, prepare syringes, apply the emdication, get the defibrilaltor ready for use, performa cardiac massage, intubate, ventilate and everything else all at once? He wouldn't even be able to handle everything alone, which means he shouldn't even be carrying them. Unless he's a well trained octopus. If there was an eminent need for such things, Michael shouldn't even be at home at first place.

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

I actually asked my mother about the hospital beds thing (she has been a nurse for 25+ years) and she confirmed that CPR should never be given on a bed - doesn't matter how firm it is, especially when the person could be moved to the floor. Hospital beds are firmer than most beds, yet nurses/doctors are still required to put a backboard underneath a patient when giving CPR. You can see the same opinion from several other doctors and nurses.

If you are on a hospital, you pretty much make sure you're not missing any routine, specially since materials are always placed in a way the routine will be performed as efficiently as possible. One rule in medicine is that nothing is 100% a rigid rule (no pun intended). I'm quite sure the fact michael's CPR was made on a bed was not what ultimately lead to his death, and putting the blame on that is really a bit too much. I do question the way the maneuver was done as described by his attorney though. That on the other hand sounds weird, and could have actually made CPR non-efficient.

I'm not denying this doctor might have some guilty on the whole thing though. I'm just pointing out that we shouldn't be palcing the blame over things that really might not have fully interfered in this outcome. It's weird that this guy was a cardiologist without a board certificate and other stuff. I wonder if Michael hired some cheap doctor so that he could to have easier/prompt access to control prescription drugs like opioid drugs though. With his money and the way some doctors prostitute their profession for money, that wouldn't really surprise me.

[JackieRos]

They are now saying that possibly a strong medicine named Diprivan may have caused his death

[rookies]

I'm going to watch Entertainment Tonight (ET) later on tonight when it airs for updates and stuff on MJ.

[Purple Neko]

I love his music! im so sad he is gone. RIP Michael

[Amrai-chan]

Originally Posted by ImpactBreaker

Where did you read that?

I heard it from the attorney. Unless I was tripping I think it was an interview with Anderson Cooper? One of those CNN people.

They are now saying that possibly a strong medicine named Diprivan may have caused his death

Yeah, some lady was making rounds to the media claiming all kinds of stuff. But she still didn't go tell the cops.

I was always going to buy his albums that I liked when I was younger (we only have cassette tapes! xD) but I feel like a sheep going to get them now I'll wait again...I wonder when the 100+ unreleased songs he's recorded will start to leak?

I'm kind of the same. I have his albums and all but I never got around to buying alot of The Jackson 5/The Jacksons stuff and I need to re buy my MJ DVDs because I can't find them for some reason.

and that 100+ should be more like 500+ hehe. I remember Quincy Jones saying something like there was at least 800 songs written/recorded for just Thriller which they eventully cut to what it is now and Michael has mentioned that he records several hundred songs per album.

If they're all completed who knows?

The song Hold My Hand leaked a while ago though...

Don't really think the songs will leak but I've heard the album he was working on with Will.I.Am finished so...we will see in due time.

[pchan1986]

check out his last rehearsal on CNN.com i love the guitar and i wonder what song that is. it sounds GREAT!^^

[Amrai-chan]

The song is They Don't Care About Us from the HIStory album.

That was cool he blended the songs They Don't Care About Us, HIStory then back to TDCAU, then the horn was from She Drives Me Wild but the beat was from Why You Wanna Trip On Me.

He didn't go full out because it was a rehersal but imagine if he had. Epic.

[AyUta]

Did you guys know that they had one of MJ's Neverland rides at the Pleasanton Fair this year in honor of him? I went yesterday and I got to see it! It was in the kids section of the fair, but apparently adults can ride it too. I thought that was cool . Butler Amusement bought it in a private auction or something like that in September of last year I think.

[ll moments ll]

is anyone trying to get the free memorial tickets at the L.A. Staples Center for Tuesday? you can register for them here: http://www.staplescenter.com/memorial.php if you can make it. they're only doing this until tomorrow July 4th by 6PM (PST) so hurry!

i just submitted the online form. i hope by some miracle i get a pair. @_@;;

[rookies]

Originally Posted by AyUta

Did you guys know that they had one of MJ's Neverland rides at the Pleasanton Fair this year in honor of him? I went yesterday and I got to see it! It was in the kids section of the fair, but apparently adults can ride it too. I thought that was cool . Butler Amusement bought it in a private auction or something like that in September of last year I think.

You're lucky, you got to see it, that's cool.

Were there a lot of people at this fair?