What is the cure?

[waterballoon]

huh really, people don't think she's releasing generic music these days?

Party queen... um half of its 4 promotional tracks are the current trendy dance music (NaNaNa, Shake It ), the title track is another dance track.

Also You & Me is generic as hell sorry, I love it but i can't deny that it's a generic song, though u could argue it's a seasonal song so all right fine.

but i don't think this lady has ever anchored herself into any style/trend for long; every album is something different... some differences may not be too obvious or may be similar to another album but each album is distinct. this is why I love ayumi hamasaki.

and she may not be #1 now and she may make dumb (imo) decisions very often now but imo she hasn't exactly lost her magic. i still like Namie Amuro and Kuu a lot but they never really shift styles as quickly as transiently as Ayu.

i don't think a cure is needed; Ayu never was popular forever - her peak lasted around the same time as many singers; ASFxx to LOVEppears was a build up, and her peak was from Duty to I am... and really escalated during the RAINBOW era, and we know by Memorial address she's already declining in sales. so yes imo she has always been as she is. it's just that fans move on, and it's silly for her to try too hard to "win" them back, if it means losing "ayumi hamasaki - the product". cos that's a gem in J-Pop.

[Andrenekoi]

^You can absorb the trends without making something generic with them... You & Me is as generic as her seasonal singles can be... But Nanana and Shake It have way too much rock influence to be generic dance tracks... They simply couldn't be released by somebody else.

[Mimichild]

I agree with most of this thread but I think the problem most people don't realize is that Ayu doesn't have anything to prove anymore. In a way she reminds me of Mary J. Blige because earlier in her career, her music was filled with alot of pain. Now she's overcome those demons and most people don't like that she's singing about different things. With Ayu, if you would look back at her earlier career her music was mostly angsty and feel with alot of self-disappointment. Her (in-depth) interviews were serious and she constantly felt that she had to fight with her inner demons to finally accept herself and the iconic,flawless music she created was the outlet.

However, she's older now! She doesn't have much inner pain (to the fans knowledge) and is able to overcome obstacles quicker than she used to (going deaf, losing a friend, divorce) compared to back then. Also, like many of you said, she's at that point that she wants to experiment with music just for fun, and there's nothing wrong with that. Actually I'm one of the few that is IN LOVE with PQ, FIVE, NEXT LEVEL, Love Songs, and You & Me. I think it sounds better than anything from My Story, Secret, and to some extent m(u) & Guilty but that's my opinion.

And one last thing. I honestly don't believe her music went downhill, it's just so many people have outrageously high standards for her. I swear it's like they want a beautiful ballad and get a song like Virgin Road, Return Road, and HBYA and gets the response "It's no Seasons! It'll never be as good as HANABI!! Grr-grr!" Also, I remember so many people wanted a catchy dance song and we got NaNaNa, Shake It and got the response "It's medicore! We hate Timmy!" and FINALLY people wanted something experimental and we got the POWERFUL Brilliante, Tell Me Why, the NEXT love, and Eyes, Smoke, Magic was once again people weren't sastified....seriously what do you want from her?? A recycled version of M & evolution so others can complain about it?

Finally about the Namie and Kuu-chan situation. I agree with someone said about their earlier albums. Personally I don't like Namie's albums (as a whole) up until STYLE. I found them to be very forgettable and her voice didn't sound nearly as cool as it does now. And for Kuu-chan, the only albums I can highly consider ALBUMS are Kingdom, JAPONESQUE, and to some extent feel my mind. So of course nobody is gonna complain about these two is because they never really set the bar that high in terms of music. Now Utada...I can't complain about this woman...she's just a genius lol

[isthisLOL?]

Originally Posted by Andrenekoi

^You can absorb the trends without making something generic with them... You & Me is as generic as her seasonal singles can be... But Nanana and Shake It have way too much rock influence to be generic dance tracks... They simply couldn't be released by somebody else.

This. There's also irony and sarcasm(more and less subtle) thoughout the entire "dance section" of Party Queen and every one of those songs has vastly different influences, making them far from generic.
Compare that to most of the new tracks on Uncontrolled and you know what generic is. And no, I am not saying Uncontrolled is bad, I really like the album, it's just as generic as generic comes, especially the tracks released this year, and nicely show that Ayumi is really not being generic.

[ExodusUK]

I don't care if she flops as long as she doesn't have to be basic like Namie has ever since PLAY.

[Ayuminaj]

Ok, I don't care if Ayu sells not as well as before but it's still interesting to read you guys and I found something interesting !

http://ajw.asahi.com/article/cool_ja...AJ201208100045

This interesting and precise article gives its own simple explanation why Ayu sells less than Miliyah Kato, Kana Nishino and all of them sell less than AKB48 (all these artists are quoted in the article) : lyrics.

Basically it says people (only "gals" in the article) don't want to listen to sad and complicated songs anymore. I think someone said something about that here.

However I don't like how the article only focuses on gals, way too precisely, and easily links them to Ayu's success. While I'm not sure we can clearly know what a "gal" is.

Of course we don't want Ayu to do something she doesn't feel just to raise sales, and change her lyrics-style is really a tough thing.
Maybe bring a new music-style can do something and start a new trend which will make people listen to complicated lyrics again. If we believe this article, doing like Namie or anybody else won't work. Because Ayu's lyrics won't change.

Anyway sales are not important, what matters is Ayu doing music i like.

[Zeke.]

Originally Posted by Mimichild

and FINALLY people wanted something experimental and we got the POWERFUL Brilliante, Tell Me Why

To my knowledge basically the entire forum worshiped these songs when they were released and still speak highly of them, overall... Of course people aren't going to be satisfied when one or two good songs out of 15 a year are released...

Although, I do wonder where people expected Ayu to be today? I don't really know what I expected, I guess I expected her to just keep getting better and better... I remember thinking around Memorial address, MY STORY, (miss)understood "I really don't see her ending up like Seiko. There is no way that is possible with the type of music this woman releases! It's so good!" and now the painful reality is starting to set in...

[ayu_ready?]

I honestly expected her to be happily married with Nagase a while ago. LOLz. I mean when for me she was on her peak. I really did think what it would be in future for Ayu. but after 2007 I think I just stopped to care about it that much

some time I thought at 30+ she'd be happily married, maybe have children, and keep releasing some sweet good ballads from time to time. I also thought she'd be having some show or anything just to keep earning money

[letter]

What is pop music? A product that affects the generation in which it exists. You can take it personally, approach it seriously, but what is the talent that makes you a hit? Is it a talent that's going to be revered in hundreds of years after your death?

Ayu's going to continue with her career probably for as long as she can. Then when she can no longer stand on stage, she will disappear. The people who know her now will one day die too, and their kids won't care about her. So what is this fame? What are the sales? The general public supports you, so that you can support yourself. Sales don't mean s**t. Sorry.

This is a subject that requires a lot of thought and would take a lot of time to put it into one comment if I were to examine Ayu's character.

I can think of a singer who has been in the business for longer than Ayu and not once did she make me doubt her artistic credibility, her passion, her devotion to her work. Tori Amos. Working in the same profession for ten years is not a good enough excuse. Other people spend their whole lives working one job. Uninspired? Move, before you become stagnant. Uninterested in anything other than your safe circle? That's death. I'm willing to believe that the reason Ayu's lyrical material seems limited is because she's not interested in anything else - or perhaps that limit applies to the expanse of her intellect and emotions, therefore she's unable to find new subjects to elaborate on. I wouldn't call her emotionally shallow, but there's a possibility she's lost her curiosity over the years and thus morphed into a being whose natural inclination to evolve has been stilled. When she has nothing new to say, it means there's nothing interesting happening in her life. If there is, and she's just not going to talk about it, then she's limiting herself, and if she doesn't care to expand her vocabulary to touch on things that surely exist in the world but don't personally affect her little world, then that is indicative of shallowness, whether its quality is plain or inborn. Has she, over the years, decided to stick to a well-known formula because it's what she thinks her fans want or is it natural? What is really her limit? Actually, in the past some people referred to her as slow. Perhaps that is the case, if she can't sing about anything other than what she already does. I wouldn't care about the sales at all if the music was getting better. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if her sales dropped then. She can produce an album like Love songs. Nothing revolutionary about it, but it's a nice pop record. I like to witness a gradual progression in an artist (artist who lives while I live, at least). In Ayu's case, I could see it clearly for the first few years. She was interesting then. Now, I don't even recognise her. I understand that her recent albums have all been about her life. But they're so drastically different that they don't show progression - they seem like albums released at the exact same time, albums from five different ideas. GUILTY. NEXT LEVEL. Rock'n'Roll Circus. Love songs. Party Queen. These are image albums. They create an image of an idea. The lyrics are scattered all over the place. The mental state of the singer is not discernible when listening to them one after another. The singer seems stagnant. The fancy clothes and new sound do not convince me. I don't expect Ayu to start writing lyrics like Tori Amos. But it would be nice to get an album that shows there's still some spirit left in her. The Rock'n'Roll Circus tour made me cringe. Her behaviour nowadays makes me cringe. She's blank and boring.

Excuse the chaotic nature of this post. I'm tired.

[Zeke.]

^ I enjoyed your take and appreciate the long post. However, I dislike when artists are bashed because they aren't 'deep' enough. Sure, it's nice to see a deep artist, with a visionary properly expressed - but what is it if the music does not sound good? Sometimes you just want something that SOUNDS great, regardless of if it's mindless, if you can't understand it, etc.

[letter]

^I'm not saying Ayu lacks depth per se. Merely that what I once witnessed, recently has been given to us in deficient quantities, and I'm confused as to whether it's deliberate or natural.

[Minttulatte]

I think I have said it before but I'll say it again. Timmy is one of the best things that has happened for Ayu's music in years. Now I just wish CREA could make a comeback as well at least for one song. I don't mind if it was a piano driven love song, it would be nice if CREA was back someday. I never lose my optimism regarding this fact.

She also needs to start releasing singles again. I can't believe it's been almost 2 years since the last one. I also hope for more TV performances and all that. I'm starting to lose my interest in her again, sadly. :/

And her lyrics... Well, she does has these repetitive lyrics in some songs, but not all of them. But even though I find myself enjoying her music these days (hell, I'm one of those few who love Party Queen! XD) her themes are almost always the same. It's been like that since GUILTY I believe but I didn't really care about it first, because I thought that on new album she'll have lots of new stuff to write about but ended up being disappointed. She seems to use same themes but different words to express herself. But at the same time I just don't care what kind of songs she writes as long as she's personally happy with them. But I do think that albums with a story (like Party Queen) are amazing and she should release more albums like that. Not in same style but so that they have a concept and songs are in a order that tells a story.

What's with her fascination with gyaru fashion these days btw? I have nothing against it (anymore hehe) but I think that she hasn't used this style this much before. I'm kinda over it for now. I want a new fashion style already but I guess I gotta wait until the next album. XD

//Sorry if this message is confusing. I'm just so ****ing tired at the moment. It's 2:10AM in Finland after all

[Bigtop]

Originally Posted by Ayuminaj

Ok, I don't care if Ayu sells not as well as before but it's still interesting to read you guys and I found something interesting !

http://ajw.asahi.com/article/cool_ja...AJ201208100045

This interesting and precise article gives its own simple explanation why Ayu sells less than Miliyah Kato, Kana Nishino and all of them sell less than AKB48 (all these artists are quoted in the article) : lyrics.

Basically it says people (only "gals" in the article) don't want to listen to sad and complicated songs anymore. I think someone said something about that here.

However I don't like how the article only focuses on gals, way too precisely, and easily links them to Ayu's success. While I'm not sure we can clearly know what a "gal" is.

Of course we don't want Ayu to do something she doesn't feel just to raise sales, and change her lyrics-style is really a tough thing.
Maybe bring a new music-style can do something and start a new trend which will make people listen to complicated lyrics again. If we believe this article, doing like Namie or anybody else won't work. Because Ayu's lyrics won't change.

Anyway sales are not important, what matters is Ayu doing music i like.

Well, this is pretty interesting... I really have to wonder what high schoolers today have in mind in regards to what songs they listen to...

[tinka69]

In all honesty, sales and popularity ranks don't mean **** anymore (have you seen the US music charts? And I don't think the Japanese charts are any different). Quality music and popularity rarely seem to go hand in hand these days. It doesn't matter how many interviews, billboards or magazine covers she is put onto, all that means nothing if she can't produce quality music, because in the end that's all that matters.

I also don't believe that the internet is killing the music industry (pop music maybe?) but the sales of Radiohead's In Rainbows and Nine Inch Nail's Ghosts I-IV albums in 2008 proves that wrong. Both artists made over $1million in profit in their first week of release despite both albums being available for free download on their sites weeks prior to official release. And you don't see their overtly fake photoshopped faces plastered on every magazine or billboard.

This may sound very generic and shallow but maybe if musicians decided to actually concentrate on producing some decent music they wouldn't have this problem?

[isthisLOL?]

Originally Posted by tinka69

This may sound very generic and shallow but maybe if musicians decided to actually concentrate on producing some decent music they wouldn't have this problem?

Not generic and shallow, just unrealistic. Musical quality and success have never gone hand in hand as a whole in an industry, so producing "decent music" won't solve anyone's problem. The music business is a business, promotion and marketing are more important than the product itself for it's success, just like the food business(McDonalds is neither quality nor cheap, hell the crap kills your health, yet people buy it en masse, why? Marketing) or the clothing business or the film business(The Transformers movies and Twilight movies were big successes...) or any other business. The succesful products can be the good ones, but the important aspect is always how it is marketed and if it can be marketed well. It was the same in the 60s and 70s and 80s and 90s...the stuff with the most success was anything from awful to good(rarely great), but always marketable.

[Andrenekoi]

^I have to disagree here... Good marketing doesn't make good sales alone (most of what people call marketing isn't even marketing ), the best promotion can't sell something nobody wants/needs... But people not always wants quality, and quality is a pretty relative term.

What most of those products have in common, including peak Ayu, is that they identified a market share that wasn't being explored and focused on it (this is marketing ), Transformers and Twilight are very good examples because they really fits the "needs" of teenagers boys and girls of all age on this era. McDonalds pretty much created the concept of "fast food" with a bigger concern to hygiene than street foods and almost industrial production, what means you know what u r going to eat, it doesn't matter where u buy it.

What Ayu does right now doesn't match what teenagers "need" today as much as it did back in 2000... This makes here less "sellable" than she was...

[tinka69]

^well said ^-^

Pretty much what I wanted to say haha.

I sometimes wonder whether Avex's current marketing strategies are doing Ayu more harm than good?

[ayu_ready?]

^ maybe it's just that avex doesn't have any marketing strategies, as simple as that?

and THIS

Originally Posted by tinka69

This may sound very generic and shallow but maybe if musicians decided to actually concentrate on producing some decent music they wouldn't have this problem?

[Delicious n Bold]

Originally Posted by tinka69

This may sound very generic and shallow but maybe if musicians decided to actually concentrate on producing some decent music they wouldn't have this problem?

BUUUUUURN!
I don't want to be mean to Ayu, but whoever let some of those songs go on Party Queen needs to question their authenticity as an artist. As much as I like them, they're pretty floppy AND ayu has done better recently (love song).
It just pains me to watch ayu's career go downhill. It's inevitable, but at least she can go down gracefully with AWESOME MUSIC. I know the creative juices must be dry by now, but that's nothing a break can't fix. Rock N Roll Circus is proof that ayu still has that oomph. Party Queen just seems too sloppy and floppy. And I'd like to criticize Timmy again. He just can't sing and makes ayu look like Whitney Houston. Ouch. I hope he didn't influence the creation of Party Queen. Regardless, she need to ditch him and get Crea/Crea+DAI/DAI/Bounceback/HAL on full production mode.

[Andrenekoi]

Originally Posted by Delicious n Bold

BUUUUUURN!
I don't want to be mean to Ayu, but whoever let some of those songs go on Party Queen needs to question their authenticity as an artist. As much as I like them, they're pretty floppy AND ayu has done better recently (love song).
It just pains me to watch ayu's career go downhill. It's inevitable, but at least she can go down gracefully with AWESOME MUSIC. I know the creative juices must be dry by now, but that's nothing a break can't fix. Rock N Roll Circus is proof that ayu still has that oomph. Party Queen just seems too sloppy and floppy. And I'd like to criticize Timmy again. He just can't sing and makes ayu look like Whitney Houston. Ouch. I hope he didn't influence the creation of Party Queen. Regardless, she need to ditch him and get Crea/Crea+DAI/DAI/Bounceback/HAL on full production mode.

Eeeew! Rock'n'Roll Circus!