[Blog] Ayu announces separation from Tyson

[kendelle]

Originally Posted by a❤martian

I find it kinda weird that her agency would say that she may repair her relationship when she herself has said that she's leaving him.

Anyway, as long as she's happy, that's what's important.

It could be damage control, or their attempt at it? I mean.....I guess in terms of Japanese people getting two divorces is pretty extreme. It is Avex's job to protect their artist's image first and foremost, although to say that makes me wonder if Ayu might reconcile eventually?

I'm honestly surprised this isn't making more news but I think that's good for the both of them

[DonkeyKongRemix]

I actually did think about that though that they didn't say "divorce" but in the long run, that only seems like a technicality.

I'm sad for her. They always looked so happy and cute together.

By the way, the Gackt comments on here cracked me up because I was thinking it the whole time but was too scared to say anything.

[AyuFan2008]

I'm not surprised at all, in fact I am more surprised that it lasted this long. It was never going to go anywhere long term. Gackt is a gorgeous and talented man but I wouldn't want to be married to him for one second and that is about as long as a relationship between Ayu and Gackt would last. Love of his life is Kami BTW and he was married long before MM.

Ayu picks badly, one guy too old fashioned, one fame seeker, one gold digger and this guy, who seems decent enough but whose life is just vastly too different.

[orbitalaspect]

Originally Posted by pedronekoi

Makes me sick reading things like "Second Divorce", "10 years younger than her", "Divorcing again". These are very anti feminist arguments. So what if she's getting divorced again? So what if her husband is 1 or 10 years younger than her? What's wrong whit that? I bet if this was about a male celebrity the perspective and media approach would be very different. (it's just something I needed to say because sometimes people reproduce those arguments without thinking about how unfair it is)

Hon, no one cares about whether something seems "anti feminist". The fact is Japan's culture considers the separation of any traditional relationship to be shameful, be it marriage, family, or business. Namie Amuro got married, got pregnant, then got divorced in an extremely short timespan, and it almost ended her entire career. In fact, it is one of the greatest contributors to her tragic fall in sales from 1999-2003. Suzuki Ami's career ended over a row with her label. Even KOKIA lost a lot of fans when she went independent in 2006. It's rare that someone like Utada Hikaru can divorce without being thrown under the bus by editorialists.

Plenty of artists of both genders have been publicly shamed for dating, breaking up, changing management, suing their record label... because Japan's business culture is built on strong personal trust. Any type of breakdown (firing, legal issues, lawsuits, divorce), especially repeat breakdowns, will make someone look untrustworthy and ridiculed in the media.

I can agree that the general response would be less critical if she were a man, but people are honestly looking at Ayumi like she should not have bothered marrying Tyson if this was how it was going to turn out. That's not unexpected in Japanese culture. And frankly, I have to agree to some extent. People see a TON of similarities between Tyson and Manny, such as the broad age gap, nationality, residence, careers, and how quickly the relationships progressed. I don't think Ayu is entirely innocent here.

Let's not make this political. The idea that any culture in the world is wrong if they do not agree with your idea of what is appropriate to say about a woman, is quite selfish. And I would certainly hope you're not insinuating Japanese culture is misogynist. This is not the place to vent an opinion like that.

Originally Posted by kendelle

It is Avex's job to protect their artist's image first and foremost, although to say that makes me wonder if Ayu might reconcile eventually?

MRW you mention avex protecting Ayu's image, but they don't protect her image by doing promo for her albums or tours...

[Machiko]

I can agree that the general response would be less critical if she were a man,

but

And I would certainly hope you're not insinuating Japanese culture is misogynist.

There were no feminism discussion before your post, as far as I can see, only a single post/mention that everyone is free to express?

Didn't think believing that women should we treated with respect was called 'selfish'.

[chocopockymaster]

Originally Posted by orbitalaspect

Hon, no one cares about whether something seems "anti feminist". The fact is Japan's culture considers the separation of any traditional relationship to be shameful, be it marriage, family, or business. Namie Amuro got married, got pregnant, then got divorced in an extremely short timespan, and it almost ended her entire career. In fact, it is one of the greatest contributors to her tragic fall in sales from 1999-2003. Suzuki Ami's career ended over a row with her label. Even KOKIA lost a lot of fans when she went independent in 2006. It's rare that someone like Utada Hikaru can divorce without being thrown under the bus by editorialists.

Didn't you just prove his point? All of the artists you mention above that were thrown under the bus are women. For a more recent example of how the media in Japan crucifies women over a scandal vs. how easily they let men off the hook, please google the Elon/Becky scandal and educate yo'self.

I can agree that the general response would be less critical if she were a man, but people are honestly looking at Ayumi like she should not have bothered marrying Tyson if this was how it was going to turn out. That's not unexpected in Japanese culture. And frankly, I have to agree to some extent. People see a TON of similarities between Tyson and Manny, such as the broad age gap, nationality, residence, careers, and how quickly the relationships progressed. I don't think Ayu is entirely innocent here.

Do enlighten me; aside from the fact that they're white men what exactly strikes you as similar between an Austrian model-slash-actor and an American medical student? We really don't know jack shit about either of them or their backgrounds so that's a pretty baseless statement to make.

Let's not make this political. The idea that any culture in the world is wrong if they do not agree with your idea of what is appropriate to say about a woman, is quite selfish. And I would certainly hope you're not insinuating Japanese culture is misogynist. This is not the place to vent an opinion like that.

And let's not pretend that Japanese society is a model of social equality when it comes to men and women because it's not, though for reasons unknown you're going out of your way to make it sound like it is.

[Chibi-Chan]

Originally Posted by orbitalaspect

Let's not make this political. The idea that any culture in the world is wrong if they do not agree with your idea of what is appropriate to say about a woman, is quite selfish. And I would certainly hope you're not insinuating Japanese culture is misogynist. This is not the place to vent an opinion like that.

Japanese culture is misogynist. Actually every culture is. And that you as a man want to decide that it's appropriate to say all these things about women who got divorced or otherwise "stepped out of line" seems quite selfish to me and as if you're also quite satiesfied with the status quo.
You managed to name a handful of female celebrities who got thrown under the bus but not a single male one and you still think it has nothing to do with the fact that those celebrities are female?

[oaristos]

People see a TON of similarities between Tyson and Manny, such as the broad age gap, nationality, residence, careers, and how quickly the relationships progressed. I don't think Ayu is entirely innocent here.

She just ended a long-term relationship and you're taking about being innocent or guilty? Of what?

Sometimes you guys act worse than Japanese tabloids crucifying her.

[dreamalley]

Let's be honest: 90% of the "drama" is because Ayu actually married him.

If they'd simply dated then no one would bat an eyelash.

I'm not a big believer on marriage itself so I never understood why Ayu would wish to get married. From interviews she said she didn't feel the need to hold a ceremony or wear a wedding dress. So she could have just dated the guy and remained free.

Also, I hope she had a pre-nup.

[colorsofromance]

Originally Posted by AyuFan2008

I'm not surprised at all, in fact I am more surprised that it lasted this long. It was never going to go anywhere long term. Gackt is a gorgeous and talented man but I wouldn't want to be married to him for one second and that is about as long as a relationship between Ayu and Gackt would last. Love of his life is Kami BTW and he was married long before MM.

Yessss so true about Kami <3 during the MM days <3 I adore Gackt but he has said so many times his opinions on marriage, longterm relationships, etc and they're very different from Ayu's. I also feel he can be a bit 'traditional' when it comes to his views on women which I doubt it Ayu's cup of tea in a relationship! That said, if it happened, it would be...fascinating xD

[pedronekoi]

Originally Posted by orbitalaspect

Hon, no one cares about whether something seems "anti feminist". The fact is Japan's culture considers the separation of any traditional relationship to be shameful, be it marriage, family, or business. Namie Amuro got married, got pregnant, then got divorced in an extremely short timespan, and it almost ended her entire career. In fact, it is one of the greatest contributors to her tragic fall in sales from 1999-2003. Suzuki Ami's career ended over a row with her label. Even KOKIA lost a lot of fans when she went independent in 2006. It's rare that someone like Utada Hikaru can divorce without being thrown under the bus by editorialists.

For me that's very misogynist. Remember when Tsuyoshi Kusanagi from SMAP went out naked on the streets and get arrested? His career kept the same after this, he's still releasing singles, albuns, doing CMs and stuff like that. I'm not saying that he should been banned from the entertainment industry, but imagine if a women have done the same...

Well, I think we're going off topic here. Sorry for this, admins.

[koumori]

There was no avoiding it to a certain extent, but as long as people keep aware of the original topic and don't get too vicious, I think it should be alright. If this ends up moved then I was wrong though

[//ABEST]

Originally Posted by Sandy

TokyoHive writes the following:

In an ORICON STYLE interview, Hamasaki's agency commented, "It's a private matter so we will leave it up to her." They added, "They haven't divorced yet. It's also possible that they will talk it over and repair their relationship."

this is just dreaming but i really hope they could talk it over and be like they've been so far.. i just love seeing them together, they fit perfectly for each other (i'm only talking about the looks since i don't know what's happening behind closed doors)

it's just so sweet when people from here has seen Tyson in her concerts smiling lovingly while watching her perform

ugh i wanna have Tyson if they divorce

[attractive nausea]

Originally Posted by orbitalaspect

frankly, I have to agree to some extent. People see a TON of similarities between Tyson and Manny, such as the broad age gap, nationality, residence, careers, and how quickly the relationships progressed. I don't think Ayu is entirely innocent here.

Manny is only two years younger than Ayu, Manny is Austrian and not American, Manny is a model/actor while Tyson isn't related to any of that. Where are your ton of similarities now?

[DonkeyKongRemix]

Originally Posted by orbitalaspect

Hon, no one cares about whether something seems "anti feminist". The fact is Japan's culture considers the separation of any traditional relationship to be shameful, be it marriage, family, or business. Namie Amuro got married, got pregnant, then got divorced in an extremely short timespan, and it almost ended her entire career. In fact, it is one of the greatest contributors to her tragic fall in sales from 1999-2003. Suzuki Ami's career ended over a row with her label. Even KOKIA lost a lot of fans when she went independent in 2006. It's rare that someone like Utada Hikaru can divorce without being thrown under the bus by editorialists.

Plenty of artists of both genders have been publicly shamed for dating, breaking up, changing management, suing their record label... because Japan's business culture is built on strong personal trust. Any type of breakdown (firing, legal issues, lawsuits, divorce), especially repeat breakdowns, will make someone look untrustworthy and ridiculed in the media.

I can agree that the general response would be less critical if she were a man, but people are honestly looking at Ayumi like she should not have bothered marrying Tyson if this was how it was going to turn out. That's not unexpected in Japanese culture. And frankly, I have to agree to some extent. People see a TON of similarities between Tyson and Manny, such as the broad age gap, nationality, residence, careers, and how quickly the relationships progressed. I don't think Ayu is entirely innocent here.

Let's not make this political. The idea that any culture in the world is wrong if they do not agree with your idea of what is appropriate to say about a woman, is quite selfish. And I would certainly hope you're not insinuating Japanese culture is misogynist. This is not the place to vent an opinion like that.





MRW you mention avex protecting Ayu's image, but they don't protect her image by doing promo for her albums or tours...

For the most part, I kind of agree with you. I don't feel too severe about this whole situation (concerning her divorce) since as a fan I am obviously on the outside but I have circulated some of these ideas in my head.

I do agree with you that this situation is a little similar to her first marriage to Manny, though I'm sure there are circumstances that we are just not aware of. It does seem a little bit like a pattern.

I'm just so curious as to how this will affect her career and what path she'll take now. After her divorce with Manny, she seemed to really go into a dark place. I hope whatever happens that she'll find happiness.

[SunshineSlayer]

Originally Posted by orbitalaspect

And I would certainly hope you're not insinuating Japanese culture is misogynist. This is not the place to vent an opinion like that.

I was with you 100% until here. I don't think there is anything wrong with insinuating that or even downright saying it. Japan, while getting better, still to this day has a very deeply ingrained cultural misogyny, so deep that much of it's society both male and female is not able recognize it as such. But after five years of living there as a woman, I feel that it is very much true. However, it's only so obvious to me because that's not the culture I grew up in. That's what is normal to them, so its hard for me to say it's "wrong." But wrong or not, it is there.

And I do think this thread is an appropriate place to vent opinions like that because the reaction to a female celebrity getting divorced and that of a male celebrity getting divorced is relevant to the discussion.

Originally Posted by colorsofromance

I adore Gackt but he has said so many times his opinions on marriage, longterm relationships, etc and they're very different from Ayu's.

To an extent, I agree. But, also I feel that what Ayu says or thinks she wants, isn't necessarily what she does. Marriage, honestly, might not be something that is actually suited to her and kids may not be something that she wants in actuality. In that regard, they would be a good match. But, obviously, it's up to them, haha. Just fun to speculate about.

[BlackSilence]

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

Nagase 2.0? Or, allow me to get my hopes up for my dream pairing -- Gackt.

Originally Posted by Yannetakizawa

Gackt always loved Ayumi ...
Maybe Gackt was waiting for a opportunity // joke

Originally Posted by EndOfTheWorld

I don't think Gackt will ever get married. I don't even think he plans on it.
He has stated before that he is terrible at commitment and staying in long term relationships. It looks like Ayu is definitely ready for a husband and family life.
But I dream it too.

You guys well i ship them two so. But um GACKT was married ages ago as well so.

[EndOfTheWorld]

I don't see how feminism is relevant to Ayu splitting from her husband.
If you have a problem, it is with the media and society, not Ayu. Ayu's failed relationship is not a political issue. And I would say that it is self centered to use a negative event in her life to promote the liberal agenda.

There are things that are more scandalous if a woman did it or more scandalous if a man did it. It goes both ways in the world. Females are not the only victims. Isn't thinking that a woman is a helpless victim anti feminist? All the female celebrities that were mentioned earlier all bounced back from their scandals very nicely. Especially Namie Amuro, I always admired her strength as a woman. I think Japan is harsher towards women but they are harsh towards the littlest thing that happens no matter what so. Asian media and people sometimes annoy me because if a celebrity makes a small mistake or something unfortunate happens, they become so nasty and judgemental. In Japanese society you are expected to always be perfect and have a good reputation and be honorable. So when something happens they make a big deal out of it.

I would have to agree with orbitalaspect that just because Japan has a different culture than the one you know, doesn't make it misogynist. Japanese culture and society is not perfect and could use more equality, like anywhere. But don't use Ayu to promote your views and try to make yourself look good. NOBODY likes social justice warriors. Yuck. I support equality for all people, everyone is valuable in their own special way but calm down. This is only celebrity news, not a societal issue.

Ayu is going to do what she wants at the end of the day because she is a woman with a strong head on her shoulders and a strong heart in her chest. Japan won't break her.

[ayupan90]

The posts on this thread are super entertaining ��

Also, totally saw this coming. Haven't seen her wear her ring in ages. Might've meant nothing but it definitely made me think something might've been up.

[Machiko]

EndOfTheWorld, I don't... quite think you understood what people are talking about here... The failed relationship isn't the anti-feminist/feminist issue, nor has anyone claimed it to be, I fail to see how you could understand it that way. I recommend you read through people's points again!

Pointing out sexism and problems in society that harms women is in no way making women "helpless victims", it's pointing out the issues we're trying to fix and make better, improve? So the opposite of helplessness, as I see it. Just sounds like a strawman from a person who doesn't understand the concept.

I would have to agree with orbitalaspect that just because Japan has a different culture than the one you know, doesn't make it misogynist.

Yes... it does? Huh? I don't get your argument. Misogyny is dislike, hatred of women, discrimination and prejudice against women, how does that change because it's "different culture"? When I look up the definition of word "Misogynist/misogyny" it doesn't seem to exclude Japanese culture. Do correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm preeeeeetty certain I'm not!
Do we have to accept discrimination and unfair treatment of women because it's "part of their culture"? You say you support equality for all people, but it has been and still is part of every culture? You say Japanese culture is not perfect and needs more equality but then argue against those who point out the unjust and inequality?
I really, really do not get your argument, sorry.

Someone pointed out how sexist media is against her, pointing out how she's put down because she's a woman (as it's been agreed that women indeed are treated far worse/harsher than men are), wording as if her divorcing her husband is a crime she's committing, so now we're... using her for something? If you see something unjust happening to someone and you point it out or/and try to fix it/change it, you're only using the target to "promote your agenda"? Really now...

???

It's probably difficult to notice, but about everything is a societal issue. More or less. She's a celebrity, and that doesn't exclude the part where she's a woman, a human being, and those societal issues affect her just as much as anyone else.