[Namie Amuro] The 98th Thread ♛ Final Album, Tour & Retirement ♛

[ladyluthien]

Originally Posted by Baco__

I don't know about you, but I don't even have a job and I'm already thinking about my retirement money. Why wouldn't she? Hahaha

HAHAHA yes!

[Katsuyuki012]

Originally Posted by ahtka-chan

I still don't see why not going to music shows or constantly thinking about quitting is a problem. I read your bible, but I still think you need dishes to do, or a new videogame to play because your reason to not like her and all is so... stupid.

It's not not going to TV shows itself but it's her, let's say, "stupid" reason not to go because she has "nothing interesting to say". She can give an interview, so she can talk a few minutes and answer basic questions. Quitting is a problem to me because I have a strong dislike for this kind of attitude that she has, only thinking about quitting all the time when she supposedly likes/loves her job..

[EndOfTheWorld]

Originally Posted by Katsuyuki012

I just don't believe this whole thing with her loving to perform, maybe she liked it but if she really loved singing and dancing her dream wouldn't be to retire (yet with a bang) and she definitely wouldn't retire at such young age. Her dream would be to do it as long as she could and that's not the case as we know. Maybe she liked it, but I wouldn't say it's love.

I think perhaps you have a romanticized view of music stars. Not everyone can be like Ayu, performing until they physically can't do it anymore for the sake of the soul and art. For a Japanese female, Namie has had a very long career. Japan is ageist towards female pop stars. Usually careers only last 5 or 10 years if they are fortunate. So in a Japanese point of view, Namie is retiring at a significant age.
And the dream isn't to retire. It was to do what she had a passion for and be successful. That interview showed that she did in fact want to excel at being a pop star and be as successful as she can. She did all these things. I think she wanted her retirement to be a grand celebration of her long career and so if that meant waiting 5 extra years she wasn't going to let that change her vision. She isn't just saying, I'm bored with this so bye. She didn't have to release the Finally album and remake her hits and begin a huge farewell tour. She easily could have released a greatest hits collection and one new song and said goodbye. But she is putting in a lot of extra work that she doesn't have to do. I think perhaps that is an indicator that she does care. Retiring before old age doesn't delegitimize her career or sincerity. It's quite normal actually. You have to look at the whole picture. Namie is a very nuanced person.

[Katsuyuki012]

It's not only ayu, it's like many other artists and even performers too... And actually, many Japanese singers are still there from "older times"... I don't often hear about someone retiring at 40.. Outside japan it might be a different story, yes, but even inside Japan it's not like everybody just retires... I wouldn't say I have a "romanticized" view since I am aware there is not only ayu... It's also not only about her retiring at 40 but her already thinking about/aiming for it at much younger age when she wasn't into her career for long time. Many Japanese singers are still out there - just not as successful. But they prefer their job, passion etc. over success. With Namie it's pretty much the opposite thus she retired too. I do understand that she wants to go while being successful still but I personally have a dislike for that... I am not denying the importance of success though.
And let's just assume she actually did love her job, retiring (so she can go while being successful) would say enough about her even then.

[Cahz-]

Originally Posted by ahtka-chan

I still think you need dishes to do, or a new videogame to play because your reason to not like her and all is so... stupid.

So is your post. As if "doing the dishes" or "playing videogames" and disliking the attitude of a singer are somehow related.

[EndOfTheWorld]

Originally Posted by Katsuyuki012

It's not only ayu, it's like many other artists and even performers too... And actually, many Japanese singers are still there from "older times"... I don't often hear about someone retiring at 40.. Outside japan it might be a different story, yes, but even inside Japan it's not like everybody just retires... I wouldn't say I have a "romanticized" view since I am aware there is not only ayu... It's also not only about her retiring at 40 but her already thinking about/aiming for it at much younger age when she wasn't into her career for long time. Many Japanese singers are still out there - just not as successful. But they preffer their job, passion etc. over success. With Namie it's pretty much the opposite thus she retired too. I do understand that she wants to go while being successful still but I personally have a dislike for that... I am not denying the importance of success though.
And let's just assume she actually did love her job, retiring (so she can go while being successful) would say enough about her even then.

Momoe Yamaguchi retired in her early 20s during peak popularity. That's unheard of here in the west. Singers retire at all different ages and for their own reasons. I just don't see the problem with thinking about retirement while being active. Retiring is part of the job, sooner or later it will happen. Would you hold it against someone if they thought about death before they die?
I guess I just have a different interpretation of her than you do.

[Katsuyuki012]

Originally Posted by EndOfTheWorld

Momoe Yamaguchi retired in her early 20s during peak popularity. That's unheard of here in the west. Singers retire at all different ages and for their own reasons. I just don't see the problem with thinking about retirement while being active. Retiring is part of the job, sooner or later it will happen. Would you hold it against someone if they thought about death before they die?
I guess I just have a different interpretation of her than you do.

Obviously you can think about but also, she was dreaming of this huge farewell concert all the time, the way she presented it is like all the time she couldn't wait to finally finish her career and go while she is still at the top. Like, what's so wrong about going without a dome tour if you can do what you supposedly 'love' for a much longer time... For me it's really just, ugh, this kind of 'dream' just is so 'toxic' to me. I just really have a problem with that but I do see your point and understand it... And obviously I wouldn't with the death but if we'd adapt Namie's situation to death, it'd be like someone having a great life, not old tho, who can't wait to be older and finally die so he can look back at their life.
Obviously I WILL want to look back at my life and be happy when I die but I don't want to think about it now that I am still young nor do I want that in 25 years. Same with whatever passion / job (supposedly Namie's/my passion)

[ahtka-chan]

Originally Posted by Cahz-

So is your post. As if "doing the dishes" or "playing videogames" and disliking the attitude of a singer are somehow related.

I'm sorry, sweetie, if my post upset you, but I didn't mean to be disrespectful to anyone. I just think it's a really stupid/dull reason to dislike someone or their work just because they're not extremely passionate about it, or because they don't do some things. NO ONE needs to do things they don't like. She doesn't like to go to TV shows, and just because she's a singer, she doesn't need to do something that's umconfortable to her.

Coming here and writing a book just to tell all the reasons you don't like her and giving those reasons, for me, sounds like a bad use of time, and doing dishes, studying, playing videogame or even sleeping seems like more productive things to do.

It's not anyone's obligation to like someone, so I just wonder why that kid took time to do that. And judging by most of replies here, people didn't really get that either.

[Zahara]

Yeah, I tried to read that wall of text and it's making me glad that I'm not that invested.

[Katsuyuki012]

Originally Posted by ahtka-chan

I'm sorry, sweetie, if my post upset you, but I didn't mean to be disrespectful to anyone. I just think it's a really stupid/dull reason to dislike someone or their work just because they're not extremely passionate about it, or because they don't do some things. NO ONE needs to do things they don't like. She doesn't like to go to TV shows, and just because she's a singer, she doesn't need to do something that's umconfortable to her.

Coming here and writing a book just to tell all the reasons you don't like her and giving those reasons, for me, sounds like a bad use of time, and doing dishes, studying, playing videogame or even sleeping seems like more productive things to do.

It's not anyone's obligation to like someone, so I just wonder why that kid took time to do that. And judging by most of replies here, people didn't really get that either.

It's me expressing my opinion and I never said Namie had to go to TV just that the reason is pretty... yea... I said it already... She didn't have to perform either if all she wanted to do is to retire. I don't just like the person who makes music because if they share private things it does influence my view of them and believe it or not, it's fine.. Do you always go on here and wonder why people write posts about their opinion just because they're negative? I suppose you don't. You don't have to agree with me as well. And at least I show people here respect unlike you who is writing down things that could be a better use of time. For me, it was a fine use of time because for a long time I wanted to express my opinion about it and yes, I still study etc..i never said that Namie needs to do this and that. I didn't write that she should perform on TV or such and by the way, it was more that some reasons were not understandable to me.. and yes it's not my obligation to like her but fact is did like her until I saw this to me revealing interview.

Just like I hope people respect my opinion I respect theirs as well and I even understand how one can question me for not liking her after this anymore. Well, I explained it already. Yes, at least she was honest about, that I appreciate but still, I can decide not to listen to a singer because of their personality and that's fine. You only focus on 'less passion' and TV while talking about my reasons. Namie always was less passionate and it was fine. But that's not all. I don't want to start writing down more reasons since I already did that.

And just so you know, it would be nice if you wouldn't refer to me as a kid. This post might come off as 'offended' or 'mean' but as much as everybody can express their opinions, reply to me with this and that, I don't like being referred to as a kid and I also don't like someone telling me what they think I do is a bad use of time and what I could do instead.

I also don't plan on writing about it forever, I just wanted to express my opinion, if talk would develop I won't run away but I in no way wanted to somehow kill this thread's mood. People should keep enjoying Namie of course.

[NintendoHTF1242]

You could use some paragraph breaks...

I appreciate the passion but to keep arguing your point is kind of... well useless. If you don’t enjoy her anymore cool but you can’t get defensive when coming into HER topic and then writing a novel on why you don’t like her because she’s not super passionate like ayu or something. But alas, I respect your opinion.

[chocopockymaster]

That was...a wall of text.

You're entitled to your opinion, but I don't think you're being very fair. As consumers, none of us will ever understand the pressures of the industry that these stars feel. And she was FOURTEEN when she debuted. Fourteen! And she kissed any and all hope of a normal childhood-into-adolescence goodbye when she and the Super Monkeys came on to the scene. Are you really going to begrudge the woman her hopes of an early retirement and a semblance of normalcy when all she had ever done was live in the spotlight? It doesn't mean she loves the music any less. Nevertheless, she persisted. I don't understand how you can hold that against her.

[Katsuyuki012]

^I don't fully buy that childhood excuse. I normally would totally agree but didn't she/they want the fame and were disappointed when it didn't happen immediately... It's not like she didn't know what she signed up for... and it was something she wanted.. I do understand her wanting a total normal life and will give her that yet that doesn't change what I wrote above.

Her private life is pretty much still private tho.

[Baco__]

let me get this straight: why are we discussing this? are we trying to prove the boy wrong and make him like namie again, or is it just to prove him wrong? I mean, everything that should be said was already said and we are just moving in circles right now imho. namie is a perfectly normal human being: thinks about her retirement and dislike talking in public. nice, let us move on and if one doesn't like those things about her, well, I'm pretty sure she's now mourning the loss of a fan.

[Sunrise]

Um. Anyway!

Hope is probably my favorite new song off of Finally now. Wish it had a video.

[maddy1111]

Originally Posted by Katsuyuki012

^I don't fully buy that childhood excuse. I normally would totally agree but didn't she/they want the fame and were disappointed when it didn't happen immediately... It's not like she didn't know what she signed up for... and it was something she wanted.. I do understand her wanting a total normal life and will give her that yet that doesn't change what I wrote above.

Problem is that you are focused on one thing and you want everyone to respect your opinion about Namie, but you are not respecting her opinion about some particular things.
On one side, you are constantly criticizing her, on the other side you don´t want to hear (or understand) any explanation she offers:
"I just don't believe this whole thing with her loving to perform..."
"I don't fully buy that childhood excuse ..."

you basically "not buying" any Namie´s explanation. You are not open to discussion then, because you have your opinion of HER and you don´t want to (or not able to) hear HER explanation and her point of view because then you are simply not buying it. You just "bought" one (according to you negative) part of interview.

[Katsuyuki012]

^Me not believing a person that they love to do something while they only think about quitting for 20 years etc, is not not respecting her opinion but questioning and yes critisizing her for being even if not in a direct way, hypocritic. I do respect what she says, what people say, yet not everything is really convincing on her side. I do admit that her being star since she was 14 tired her out in a way yet it is true she did want the fame with her group, she did know what she signed up for. Me not agreeing to/being convinced by certain arguments doesn't mean I don't respect other opinions. Other users here disagree with my opinion yet they still respect it. "Buying" something or not doesn't have to mean I dis/respect the person. And what I "bought" from this interview came from her opinion that I respected, listened to yet disagree with etc.. After all, she was talking in the interview so it's not like somebody else was talking in her place, assuming things that "I bought".

^^And no need to refer to me as "the boy" either, given my age, I understand, yes I am a boy still but I also don't refer to other people here as "the man" or "the guy" etc.. One can use either their name or the gender appropriate pronoun. It sounds more natural as well. I know you then went one with pronouns but still!

[maxikot]

I am very grateful for Katsuyuki to express his opinion which I share. I was into Namie but the stuff she said was pretty meh to me. In my eyes, she did work, enjoyed it but that piece (retirement) she simply kept bringing back. The image of the super perfectionist was simply the person who likes her work ... to some extent. I can agree that some people think of retirement early although it's beyond my understanding. I love my job (teaching) and retiring hasn't come to my mind even once. Namie is Namie so she does as she wants and that is totally fine, but not everybody has to agree with her reasoning or the way she approaches retirement or simply her job. I am taking a break from her too, most probably will get back to her at some point.

Also, I disliked the attitude of some people here. It felt like it's not fine to express elaborate criticism about her in her thread. Well, people keep criticizing Ayu on Ayu forum and the sole purpose of forum is expressing an opinion and respecting each other. Calling people to "go play videogame" or referring to them as "the boy" is really low and disrespectful. I am totally fine with others enjoying Namie, her work and the way she is retiring but it's definitely fine to read the opposite point of view as well.

[Baco__]

Didn't know that referring to a boy as the boy was offensive lol it didn't sound offensive in my head when I wrote it (nor now).

But anyway, everyone can express their opinions, but for every action there's a reaction, and coming to Namie's topic to bash on her attitude and career choices of how she portrays herself to the media/public isn't very smart of a move.

I guess the thing most of us can't understand is: why does it matter if she was thinking about retirement, of doing a grand goodbye stage (sort of following the steps of Yamaguchi Momoe and other big Japanese acts that have done such goodbye stages)? Why does it matter if she doesn't like to go to music TV shows or talking during her tours? Her job is to be a singer. She sings. That's it. Everything else is pure promotion and she didn't feel like it anymore.

You don't like that she is straightforward? Too bad. We can get back on track. I guess we're lacking Namie's tour info and that's why we kept on discussing this lmao

[himawariii6]

Originally Posted by Sunrise

Um. Anyway!

Hope is probably my favorite new song off of Finally now. Wish it had a video.

My favourite song from Finally is In Two.