Better than Hikki...

[hallelujah_united]

Originally Posted by KORiA

I agree, sorry if I came off as "MY OPINION ME ME ME."

I never really gave Adult a chance though. And when you get into Ringo you have to give things a chance. Adults slowly growing on me, I go back and watch the videos for the singles and the lives.

I was just looking at your post too much while typing a general reply.

[Kikaru]

I personally don't care about her sales. Yeah, she does sales like hot cakes, but her music isn't even close to good, in my own opinion of course. And her personality doesn't spark at all. Seeing her makes me go "Boring!". She would be eyecatching if I could she a little more energy in her, but damn. This woman is so dull. But then again, that's just me...

I think part of her success is that she was bilingual -_____-'.

Really, are bilingual asians really that interesting?

[elepop]

Originally Posted by Kikaru

I think part of her success is that she was bilingual -_____-'.

Really, are bilingual asians really that interesting?

I really don't know.

[andre2907]

^ No, I'm sure her appeal wasn't just because she was bilingual. But yes, japanese people really like her and I think she's eyecatching because nobody would sell that much only because of the music (no, really...). Plus, I think Utada Hikaru has charisma. When I show Ayu PVs to people, they're always "yes... that's a well-done PV but this woman is scary, she looks like a robot/Barbie doll and she has no charisma" and when I show a Hikki PV they go "uh... yeah, she has is more charismatic and seems more down-to-earth". Of course most people here don't agree with this comments (it's an Ayu board, after all) and I don't agree 100% either, but I think it make sense.

Anyway, I guess only people who were in Japan at the beginning of Hikki carrer knows exactly what japanese people like so much about her....

[truehappiness]

Originally Posted by Psychotic_X

T_T"" please don't tell me you're only reading "JUICY" and "SHAKE IT"

Nooo! It's just all her lyrics are a bit.. bland o_o

[Psychotic_X]

.....

[JimmyKoria]

Originally Posted by andre2907

^ No, I'm sure her appeal wasn't just because she was bilingual. But yes, japanese people really like her and I think she's eyecatching because nobody would sell that much only because of the music (no, really...). Plus, I think Utada Hikaru has charisma. When I show Ayu PVs to people, they're always "yes... that's a well-done PV but this woman is scary, she looks like a robot/Barbie doll and she has no charisma" and when I show a Hikki PV they go "uh... yeah, she has is more charismatic and seems more down-to-earth". Of course most people here don't agree with this comments (it's an Ayu board, after all) and I don't agree 100% either, but I think it make sense.

Anyway, I guess only people who were in Japan at the beginning of Hikki carrer knows exactly what japanese people like so much about her....

Some of Hamasaki's pvs are more "smart" than Utada's. Alterna for one, Ourselves is also another. Some of Hamasaki's videos are so different (Ladies Night). While other videos seem redudant and like something else she or someone else has already done.

Utada's PVs tend to use color better though. They're more surreal and dream like. The only PV she's had that has more of a serious context is Be My Last and Dareka no Negai. Colors is arguable, but it wasn't so much, "SORROW, FEELING!" it was more like, "look at these interesting images." I do have to say I enjoy Utada's PVs more.

Hamasaki is a pop act. I don't think people should be so rigorous on her. She's stepped out of bounds a few times, be happy with that(I completely contradicted myself by saying that)?

[ayu_fan929]

Originally Posted by Kikaru

I think part of her success is that she was bilingual -_____-'.

Really, are bilingual asians really that interesting?

I personally don't think so. I think it was because there weren't many non idol fabricated female singers at that time that could write their own music and lyrics and have a non-Jpoppy feel all at once?

[JimmyKoria]

Originally Posted by ayu_fan929

I personally don't think so. I think it was because there weren't many non idol fabricated female singers at that time that could write their own music and lyrics and have a non-Jpoppy feel all at once?

I think that makes more sense and also, didn't Utada bring that style of music to Japan?

[bluegie]

there should be lots of other hip hop styles before hikki... but i think she's the one making JR&B as one of the mainstreams in JPop industry. And I guess different people have different tastes. If you go to hikki's forum you'll see lots of comments of "oh she's so cute/her blog is so funny/her songs are so amazings blah blah blah". It's just personal favours. As a hikki fan I will feel sad that not all the people love hikki, but hey there's no one in the world being loved by everybody .

Originally Posted by andre2907

Have their places in Jpop history:

Extremely big:
- Yumi Matsutoya
- Southern All Stars
- B'z
- Utada Hikaru
- Ayumi Hamasaki
- Miyuki Nakajima
- Seiko Matsuda
- SMAP
- Tetsuya Komuro
- Dreams Come True
- GLAY
- Mr. Children
- Mr. Children

I think you really miss one here (IMO)... Momoe Yamaguchi. She was the hottest one in the 70's.

[ayu_fan929]

^Yeah, I think she was one of the first to make bring the genre into mainstream Jpop?

[andre2907]

Originally Posted by bluegie

I think you really miss one here (IMO)... Momoe Yamaguchi. She was the hottest one in the 70's.

I tought about having her there, but there are other big 70s stars and as I don't know much about them, I decided not to put any of them on my list. I didn't put many 80s stars too.

[Uemarasan]

Sorry for getting back to this so late. I was away on a trip.

Thank you, everyone, for contributing to the discussion It has been very interesting, and in my opinion, a lot more insightful than those simplistic Ayu versus Hikki, Better than Ayu, Koda is the bessssssssssssst threads.

I still think Exodus is a terrible album. Hikki's weakness with lyrics is at its worst, her voice does not have the same range as in her Japanese work, and composition-wise it has the same quality as a Eurobeat remix album.

My problem with Tokyo Jihen is that the group lacks the originality and innovation that Ringo Shiina was making during her solo career. Personally, I've already heard Tokyo Jihen's music before: with Pizzicato Five, for instance.

Originally Posted by Psychotic_X

T_T"" please don't tell me you're only reading "JUICY" and "SHAKE IT"

I find the majority of her lyrics unimpressive, especially if understood in the original Japanese.


I now find sales figures just one of the factors in determining the worth of an artist. X Japan was never huge in terms of single or album sales (except for Hide's side projects), and yet their musical legacy lives on years after. Plus sales figures are always arbitrary - compare the sales now and during the 70s with the sales in the mid-90s. Economic context is important.

Thankfully, I've learned from experience. Obsessing about sales is unhealthy.

Also, in my opinion, the idea that composing, writing the lyrics, and arranging songs to your liking makes you a better artist is UNTRUE if the music isn't good in the first place. For most of her career, Aretha Franklin has relied on other songwriters to make her music, and I don't think that makes her any less of an artist.

Lastly, and I think a lot of people would disagree with me, but I personally find that Ayu would not be the icon that she is without the presence of Hikki, and Hikki would not be the icon that she is without the presence of Ayu. Being "down-to-earth" is not better than being "up-in-the-stars-fantasy", those are very superficial, subjective differences. And I don't think charisma is as simplistic as having it or not; Ayu's charisma is a very different kind of charisma from Hikki's. For me, they are perfect counterpoints and foils for each other, and their legacy has only been enriched by each other's cultural differences.

Thank you again for an interesting discussion!

[Kikaru]

Originally Posted by Uemarasan

Lastly, and I think a lot of people would disagree with me, but I personally find that Ayu would not be the icon that she is without the presence of Hikki, and Hikki would not be the icon that she is without the presence of Ayu. Being "down-to-earth" is not better than being "up-in-the-stars-fantasy", those are very superficial, subjective differences. And I don't think charisma is as simplistic as having it or not; Ayu's charisma is a very different kind of charisma from Hikki's. For me, they are perfect counterpoints and foils for each other, and their legacy has only been enriched by each other's cultural differences.!

Seriously, will you marry me? That's like the best post I've read in a very very long time.

Agree completely BTW. Down-to-earth image could all be, in fact, just a image.

[Uemarasan]

Originally Posted by Kikaru

Seriously, will you marry me? That's like the best post I've read in a very very long time.

Agree completely BTW. Down-to-earth image could all be, in fact, just a image.

Aww, thanks, I'm flattered

And thank you for pointing that out. Down-to-earth is very often simply an image. Julia Roberts, for instance. Sometimes, I even doubt that Hikki is THAT down-to-earth. Being a top pop icon in Japan and having all that money does not exactly make you an ordinary joe. I think her lifestyle betrays what a lot of people think of her.

[hallelujah_united]

^After all, I believe that a lot of what people perceive stars as are images that the artists themselves have built up. We may never know what Hikki or Ayu really did for the day, the only thing that comes even remotely close is probably by reading their blogs if they have one. Even then, it's only a blog. I can put up an entry that's really happy and crazy, but who knows in real life I may have been bored to tears sitting around at home.

Still, they're fulfilling a very important part of their job though, and that's to entertain us and out imaginations.