[Namie Amuro] ♬♫♪◖Don’t you know that she's a fighter? the 93rd thread ◗♪♫♬

[voltron]

^ That may very well be, it just hasn't been my experience. And it's not a dig at Namie at all -- pop singers are very rarely really respected, which has nothing to do with commercial success. You always hear much more critical acclaim for indie acts, or more musically inclined acts like a MISIA or Mika Nakashima (who are far less popular and successful, even if they are successful in their own rights).

This is an old article, and I cringe to post it because it's Namie vs. Ayu, which is neither here nor there for this conversation, but I think the comments they quoted/translated are very much in line with what I more typically hear about Namie:
http://aramajapan.com/featured/what-...in-2015/21611/

Cute, pretty, makes fun songs, distant, etc. Those are the most common descriptors of Namie. What you hear less often are things like talented, creative, enduring, strong vocals, etc. I'm not saying she doesn't have any of those things, but that is what I mean when I say respected. I don't think the industry or the general public respect her as much as they like her.

[ahtka-chan]

Originally Posted by S4MU3L

And Namie is not respected??? please....

If you care about pop music, you'd respect her, but in general, people don't look up to or have a huge respect for pop artists, no matter the country.

I know a lot of people who like Britney Spears but they don't treat her like a goddess or an example to be followed. In her world, she's THE shit but outside entertainment world, she doesn't mean much.

I think with Namie it works the same way. She deserves credit for her career, but she's not the role model the average japanese people want.

[UHPlus]

In the earlier 2000, I was a huge fan of ayu. Her music was awesome and distinct, her vocal was soulful and beautiful. Namie (during her TK era) was generic and basically she was just singing random songs that TK thrown to her.

Now because of her hearing problem, ayumi has no vocal range and her music sounds flat. Watching her sings live (especially her older songs) was a torture. At the same time, Namie's music became more and more interesting, and her live vocal sounds better as years goes by.

[Cahz-]

Namie's music is superficial and average, there's nothing interesting about it. Also, she's overrated in all aspects, as hell. I remember one user saying back ago her music was "avant garde"
Namie doesn't write her lyrics nor compose her own music. And she won't ever be better than Ayumi, like never. Ayumi at her worst>>>>>>>>> miss perfect pop product "Namie Amuro".

[Rocky Raven]

^ Sounds pathetic much x) Like Namie's ever cared to be better or even match Ayu's image and music wise. A Namie-fan would pray to God that Namie would never be better than/the same way of Ayu, cause that's just no her in any aspect.
Namie is so much different from Ayu - you can think of Ayu as some mainstream-dramatic-emotional-blogging western young pop artists. Namie, on the other hand, is like a firmly statue that stays mystery over time.
She's overcome divorce problem, single-mother status and kept doing her thing (music and image-wise) at her best. She keeps silent over drama thing. And that gives her so much respect from Japanese people.

[Cahz-]

Yes, japanese people respect her as a hardworking businesswoman, not as an artist.

[melissalove]

Really?? Now it's namie teardown day, cause we just had a kumi teardown not so long ago.

[KarenPang]

End of the day , it's the respective artistes' fans & not the artistes themselves that tend to have issues with each other

Like if any of them appear on a TV show together , people would be flipping/freaking out while the artistes don't know what's the fuss on being on the same stage together in the 1st place

[voltron]

^ #truth. And didn't Namie attend Ayu's finale for MIJ or CdM? Famous people can support one another, or ignore one another too -- not everything is a competition. Obviously there are times that Ayu vs Namie (or Hikki or Kuu, etc.) comparisons are useful because they're all mainstream and have been successful...but tearing down one act doesn't make another better. And likewise, making criticisms or observations about one act, doesn't diminish their success or popularity, it's just not being a total fanboy/fangirl that can't see reality.

[ahtka-chan]

I don't understand what people see in Ayumi, even in her hey day. But I don't see any point in comparing her to Namie ou even bringing her to Namie's thread.

They are different artists, they appeal different audiences and their artistry is not alike at all.

[thinkingoutloud89]

Originally Posted by ahtka-chan

I don't understand what people see in Ayumi, even in her hey day. But I don't see any point in comparing her to Namie ou even bringing her to Namie's thread.

They are different artists, they appeal different audiences and their artistry is not alike at all.

just to answer in short: Her honest lyrics and self-reflection which pretty much hit the nail on the head for JapanS youth at the time.

and...you are right! Comparison is okay though, as long as it is objective.

[ahtka-chan]

^I expressed myself badly. I know she was celebrated as a lyricist and all, I just can't relate to it, you know?

I read her lyrics, they are nice, but what people see as honesty, it could be just a marketing strategy. But even that doesn't matter.

I just don't like to see people comparing as if artists are equal. Ayumi was doing music to (maybe) deal with her life and find happiness (?) while Namie is just making songs so people can dance a lot in the clubs. There's nothing wrong with different objetives, and one is not better than the other because of the message they are trying (or not) to convey.

[JackieRos]

Why are we comparing Namie and Ayumi? They make totally different genres of
music.

Originally Posted by Cahz-

Namie's music is superficial and average, there's
nothing interesting about it. Also, she's overrated in all aspects, as hell. I
remember one user saying back ago her music was "avant garde"
Namie doesn't write her lyrics nor compose her own music. And she won't ever
be better than Ayumi, like never. Ayumi at her worst>>>>>>>>> miss perfect
pop product "Namie Amuro".

And there it is that annoying comment where people say that she's not a real artist just because she doesn't write her lyrics or compose her own music.
Only a few artists write their own lyrics and compose their own music but
I only see Namie gets so much crap about it.

Namie is very reserved, you don't see her in controversies after her mother's
murder and you rarely see anything about her personal life in media. People like
that about her but some see her as a mindless "product" and just because they
don't see her life behind the scenes they always love to downgrade her.
People don't know how hard she works for her music, they don't see what's
going on.

I'm wondering why you're here if you don't like anything about her? you don't
see people going to different threads of artists to talk garbage about them.

[S4MU3L]

Originally Posted by Cahz-

Namie's music is superficial and average, there's nothing interesting about it. Also, she's overrated in all aspects, as hell. I remember one user saying back ago her music was "avant garde"
Namie doesn't write her lyrics nor compose her own music. And she won't ever be better than Ayumi, like never. Ayumi at her worst>>>>>>>>> miss perfect pop product "Namie Amuro".

[thinkingoutloud89]

how can Namie be a pop product when she pretty much struggled over years while adopting to a new sound chosen by herself? Thats one hell of an ignorant and unthoughtful comment.

[Cahz-]

Originally Posted by Minerva

Why are we comparing Namie and Ayumi? They make totally different genres of
music.

And there it is that annoying comment where people say that she's not a real artist just because she doesn't write her lyrics or compose her own music.
Only a few artists write their own lyrics and compose their own music but
I only see Namie gets so much crap about it.

Namie is very reserved, you don't see her in controversies after her mother's
murder and you rarely see anything about her personal life in media. People like
that about her but some see her as a mindless "product" and just because they
don't see her life behind the scenes they always love to downgrade her.
People don't know how hard she works for her music, they don't see what's
going on.

I'm wondering why you're here if you don't like anything about her? you don't
see people going to different threads of artists to talk garbage about them.

I have the f*cking right to talk about whatever i want of any artist on this forum. I do like Namie, but I'm not that blind to consider her the last panacea of music, as many of jpop fans like to do. Do not compare her with Ayumi? The last 5 years are full of people saying how Namie is better than her, and that Ayu should retire/go in hiatus/"Ayumi flop Namie queen flawless" bla bla, the comment above me was the first one to bring Ayumi into this thread. Sorry "Minerva", TOO LATE FOR THAT
The "garbage" you are saying is what I think about her, you may disagree, but you won't cancel my opinion just because I talk "bad things" about Namie Amuro. I already said it, one can respect her as a hardworking businesswoman, she's not the "flawless artist" many of her wants want her to be. She's not Shiina Ringo, nor Mika Nakashima, she's just superficial pop, period. And there's nothing wrong with that, but of course some of her fans just can't accept the truth. Not my problem.

Originally Posted by thinkingoutloud89

how can Namie be a pop product when she pretty much struggled over years while adopting to a new sound chosen by herself? Thats one hell of an ignorant and unthoughtful comment.

And Namie choose electropop because of an artistry's purpose? Please. Namie reminds me of JLo, how she went from R&B/Urban to dance pop to stay relevant. And you don't see people calling JLo a "great artist".

[ahtka-chan]

^You can say whatever you want, but you don't need to be disrespectful like you are.

She's not the savior of Jpop, indeed, but among the last two decades diva, she's in a much stronger place than Kumi, ayaka, Ayumi and many others. That doesn't make her better, but makes her more relevant to the current market.

And not because someone brought artist A and B to the thread that you need to do the same.

The way you write, it looks like you're just b--thurt because some people here don't think ayumi is a good singer.

If people want to call Namie a great artist, what's wrong with that? That doesn't hurt you and it doesn't concern you. I think Utada is the queen of the universe, and I don't care if people agree with me or not because that's MY opinion and it does not affect anyone.

It feels like you want people to look down on Namie and worship Ayumi just because you think she's the most perfect human being on Earth. Relax, dude.

[Cahz-]

Originally Posted by ahtka-chan

^You can say whatever you want, but you don't need to be disrespectful like you are.

She's not the savior of Jpop, indeed, but among the last two decades diva, she's in a much stronger place than Kumi, ayaka, Ayumi and many others. That doesn't make her better, but makes her more relevant to the current market.

Yes, "relevant""market", you just have said it: business. Where's the artistry?
I don't want people to worship Ayumi, but after twenty years of writing her lyrics (where she has explored a lot of issues, even social ones: Mad world) composed almost 3 albums by herself, experimenting with rock, trance, "ethereal-pop"(RAINBOW), even traditional music, etc (I wouldn't have to mention it, since we're in an Ayu forum and I guess people here know all the things Ayu have done in her career); I won't accept that one person comes here and tell Namie is better than her.
The Arama comments are the perfect example of what I'm talking about. And I end all this here, not my intention to fight with the users.
PS. If you consider the word "f*ck" disrespectful, 1st. I didn't use it to attack any user 2nd. I'm tired of people playing the "if you don't like her why you talk about her" card, as if one person is not allowed to say anything about other's work just because it's not his/her cup of tea.

[jean-baptiste]

Originally Posted by Cahz-

PS. If you consider the word "f*ck" disrespectful, 1st. I didn't use it to attack any user 2nd. I'm tired of people playing the "if you don't like her why you talk about her" card, as if one person is not allowed to say anything about other's work just because it's not his/her cup of tea.

You're implying that you wish to be respected for your opinion when you are blatantly and rudely diminishing the opinions of those saying they prefer one artist over the other.

Originally Posted by Cahz-

I don't want people to worship Ayumi, but after twenty years of writing her lyrics (where she has explored a lot of issues, even social ones: Mad world) composed almost 3 albums by herself, experimenting with rock, trance, "ethereal-pop"(RAINBOW), even traditional music, etc (I wouldn't have to mention it, since we're in an Ayu forum and I guess people here know all the things Ayu have done in her career); I won't accept that one person comes here and tell Namie is better than her.

You kind of have to accept it...the world is big and you're gonna meet people everyday who's perspective is different than your own. It's called growing up. I don't even think ayu cares to defend herself as much as you're doing right now.


For the record, I am huge fans of both women and have equal respect for both of them. Both ayu and Namie have shown the ability to evolve as artists, maintain relevance (to varying degrees) and have their respective successes. Having a fight about who's better than the other because someone simply prefers one over the other is a bit ridiculous.

[Cahz-]

Originally Posted by S4MU3L

Come back to APT, puta