Another Hikki/Ayu Showdown?

[PSYCHEDELICOdust]

Originally Posted by sxesven

Everytime I read how much people despise Exodus I can't help but being entirely baffled. The claims that Hikaru 'deserted' pop music and went hip-hop seem pretty unfunded. Hikaru has never been a pop artist to begin with, having started out as a (pretty generic) R&B artist and eventually turning out to be a lot more. 'Deep River' already drew influences from everywhere while still retaining Hikaru's R&B-ish style. It made for a very eclectic and challenging album that showed Hikaru was a brilliant musician and exceeded 99% of the mainstream acts in quality and sheer excellence.

Exodus seemed to be the only logical follow-up to Deep River (although Utada was indeed not Hikki, but that aside - it's still the same musician). On the musical side of things it's amazing. Cracking synth sounds, buzzing beats. It's at times almost avant-garde yet always entirely infectious and catchy. It's got more in common with Peaches and M.I.A. than with your regular American mainstream act. And because Exodus is indeed such a musical achievement, I just don't understand why people hate it so much. Ignorance? I don't know.

omfg sven <3


Ayu VS. Hikki topics are stupid, it shouldn't matter as long as you like the music =/

[Halla]

Originally Posted by sxesven

Everytime I read how much people despise Exodus I can't help but being entirely baffled. The claims that Hikaru 'deserted' pop music and went hip-hop seem pretty unfunded. Hikaru has never been a pop artist to begin with, having started out as a (pretty generic) R&B artist and eventually turning out to be a lot more. 'Deep River' already drew influences from everywhere while still retaining Hikaru's R&B-ish style. It made for a very eclectic and challenging album that showed Hikaru was a brilliant musician and exceeded 99% of the mainstream acts in quality and sheer excellence.

Exodus seemed to be the only logical follow-up to Deep River (although Utada was indeed not Hikki, but that aside - it's still the same musician). On the musical side of things it's amazing. Cracking synth sounds, buzzing beats. It's at times almost avant-garde yet always entirely infectious and catchy. It's got more in common with Peaches and M.I.A. than with your regular American mainstream act. And because Exodus is indeed such a musical achievement, I just don't understand why people hate it so much. Ignorance? I don't know.

I think people hate Exodus simply because they don't like what they hear on it.

I don't think the album is horrible , it's mostly ruined by her vocal performance for me. i don't get how she sounds so good on songs like 'Travelling' or 'Sakura Drops' or on my first song by her and my favorite 'Addicted to you' (both versions), and yet so shrill on many songs on Exodus. I agree the instrumentals on Exodus are interesting , but I can't really enjoy them because the vocals.

[sxesven]

Originally Posted by Halla

I think people hate Exodus simply because they don't like what they hear on it.

Not liking it is one thing, pretending as if its the worst album ever is something different imo, but well. Fair enough.

As for Utada's vocal performances, I think they're sufficient although they have been going downhill since Deep River already. Sakura Drops, for instance, had some of the worst vocals ever on a Hikki song - ruined the song for me. Love the composition, but what's with all the heavy breathing?

In the end it all comes to down to taste and preferences, but as we say in Holland, 'over smaak valt wel degelijk te twisten', meaning you can't justify everything by saying it doesn't suit your taste. Different discussion though. I'm not implying that everyone here is wrong or something if it comes across as that, people just seem to be oblivious to Exodus' qualities for all the wrong reasons.

[PickleCookies]

Sven it sucks because I don't like it.

[sxesven]

Originally Posted by PickleCookies

Sven it sucks because I don't like it.

Oh, now it makes sense.

[PickleCookies]

It had better.

[greggerz189]

Originally Posted by sxesven

Everytime I read how much people despise Exodus I can't help but being entirely baffled. The claims that Hikaru 'deserted' pop music and went hip-hop seem pretty unfunded. Hikaru has never been a pop artist to begin with, having started out as a (pretty generic) R&B artist and eventually turning out to be a lot more. 'Deep River' already drew influences from everywhere while still retaining Hikaru's R&B-ish style. It made for a very eclectic and challenging album that showed Hikaru was a brilliant musician and exceeded 99% of the mainstream acts in quality and sheer excellence.

Exodus seemed to be the only logical follow-up to Deep River (although Utada was indeed not Hikki, but that aside - it's still the same musician). On the musical side of things it's amazing. Cracking synth sounds, buzzing beats. It's at times almost avant-garde yet always entirely infectious and catchy. It's got more in common with Peaches and M.I.A. than with your regular American mainstream act. And because Exodus is indeed such a musical achievement, I just don't understand why people hate it so much. Ignorance? I don't know.

I take offense to the 'ignorance' comment. I am not ignorant because I dislike Utada's Exodus album. I found no logical connection in terms of style between Deep River and Exodus whatsoever. Exodus had no songs that had the 'down to earth' style that Deep River did, and I mean the song itself, not the album as a whole. I would consider Utada previously pop because the songs traveling and DISTANCE were very much pop as was most of her first album. Musically, I thought Exodus was sorely shallow and insubstantial -- again with the lack of 'down to earth' style. By the way, I didn't HATE Exodus. I was grossly disappointed. I think my overall judgement of the Exodus album is far from ignorant or uninformed. Rather, it is more of an educated opinion.

[greggerz189]

Originally Posted by sxesven

Not liking it is one thing, pretending as if its the worst album ever is something different imo, but well. Fair enough.

As for Utada's vocal performances, I think they're sufficient although they have been going downhill since Deep River already. Sakura Drops, for instance, had some of the worst vocals ever on a Hikki song - ruined the song for me. Love the composition, but what's with all the heavy breathing?

In the end it all comes to down to taste and preferences, but as we say in Holland, 'over smaak valt wel degelijk te twisten', meaning you can't justify everything by saying it doesn't suit your taste. Different discussion though. I'm not implying that everyone here is wrong or something if it comes across as that, people just seem to be oblivious to Exodus' qualities for all the wrong reasons.

Why don't you name a few more qualities that Exodus apparently has other than it's supposedly remarkable back tracks? I'm sorry, but I listen to songs because of WHAT THEY HAVE TO SAY not because they sound cool. I prefer meaning over what some people define as "style." Exodus seems lyrically challenged at best. I don't pretend that Exodus is 'the worst album ever' either. However, I think that the numbers speak for themselves in terms of sales here in the US.

[greggerz189]

Originally Posted by PickleCookies

Sven it sucks because I don't like it.

XD lol.

[sxesven]

Originally Posted by greggerz189

By the way, I didn't HATE Exodus. I was grossly disappointed. I think my overall judgement of the Exodus album is far from ignorant or uninformed. Rather, it is more of an educated opinion.

There you go, it didn't apply to you then. No need to take offense either. I've said this before and I'll say it again, disliking it is one thing, entirely hating and not giving it the least bit of credit is another. That is in fact my main gripe, the fact that it just gets totally bashed all the frellin' time. Plus, I stated that I didn't know whether it was in fact ignorance or not.

Originally Posted by greggerz189

Musically, I thought Exodus was sorely shallow and insubstantial -- again with the lack of 'down to earth' style.

One of the first criticisms with some foundation I've read. I can actually see what you mean. As much as Hikki (imo) improved herself musically, she did certainly not succeed in maintaining the intimacy as it was heard on Deep River. As a result of the, like I said before, almost avant-garde quality of Utada, it can feel pretty distant and cold. I personally don't have a problem with that, but I can indeed see how someone is bothered with it.

Originally Posted by greggerz189

I'm sorry, but I listen to songs because of WHAT THEY HAVE TO SAY not because they sound cool. I prefer meaning over what some people define as "style."

That's where we're different - I personally couldn't care less about what's being said. Good lyrics are a nice extra for me, but if the lyrics are crap I'm not bothered. This probably has a lot to do with my musical preferences - there's not much in comprehending the lyrics in post-rock, shoegaze and post-hardcore if there are any lyrics at all.

Originally Posted by greggerz189

Why don't you name a few more qualities that Exodus apparently has other than it's supposedly remarkable back tracks?

Imo, Exodus has all the qualities an album needs. If you ask me, an album needs good song-writing and a suiting production - those are the things I personally care about. Exodus has both. Amazing production (the aforementioned cracking synth sounds and buzzing beats) which entirely support Hikki's musical growth and sonical diversity. Excellent songwriting which results in a boatload of outstanding songs (The Workout, Hotel Lobby, You Make Me Want To Be A Man, Tippy Toe, Easy Breezy, Kremlin Dusk, etc.). Result: excellent album.

Originally Posted by greggerz189

However, I think that the numbers speak for themselves in terms of sales here in the US.

Bad marketing imo, Island appealed to an entirely wrong audience. If you see how popular M.I.A. is all of a sudden, I mean, Island could have sold Exodus to the exact same crowd. Instead, they chose not to promote it at all. Bad choice, but well.

Once again, as you are capable of constructing a normal opinion and perfectly good reasoning there's no need to take offense. It's actually refreshing to read a constructive opinion once, rather than all the 'BLAH EXODUS WAZ SO BAD' and 'I HATEZ EXODUZ' and 'HORRIBLE' all the time. Exodus gets way too much bashing on this board and I think it's unfair.

[greggerz189]

I have a feeling that most of the people who purchased Exodus, however, are generally somewhat disappointed in the album, especially those who followed Hikki into mainstream US pop culture. I personally feel that the album doesn't meet up to a standard she set for herself when she released her BEST album and last single, DAREKANO NEGAI GA KANAU KORO. Like I said, I prefer the more intimate feel of her songs of old, i.e. Hikari, Deep River, FINAL DISTANCE, etc., not only musically but most especially, lyrically. Part of it has to do with the language too. I found Hikari far superior lyrically to Simple and Clean because I found the Japanese lyrics more meaningful, beautiful, touching. I'm not bashing Hikki by any standards -- her music brings back a lot of good memories of when I was first branching out into Japanese Pop. I just expected more out of her Exodus album is all. I was expecting something like how she did Simple and Clean. English versions of previously released Japanese songs. I think that traveling and Deep River and such would have made great English songs and I think that the album would have done much better in the US if she had done just that. I must admit that I do enjoy some songs from her Exodus album every now and then -- I very much like Exodus '04 -- XD it was like the only song I would listen to when I first purchased her album. I appreciate your imput and your opinion on the overall review of Exodus and Utada's US career. ^_^ It was nice exploring both sides of the issue. ^^

[heyrill]

Originally Posted by greggerz189

I have a feeling that most of the people who purchased Exodus, however, are generally somewhat disappointed in the album, especially those who followed Hikki into mainstream US pop culture. I personally feel that the album doesn't meet up to a standard she set for herself when she released her BEST album and last single, DAREKANO NEGAI GA KANAU KORO. Like I said, I prefer the more intimate feel of her songs of old, i.e. Hikari, Deep River, FINAL DISTANCE, etc., not only musically but most especially, lyrically. Part of it has to do with the language too. I found Hikari far superior lyrically to Simple and Clean because I found the Japanese lyrics more meaningful, beautiful, touching. I'm not bashing Hikki by any standards -- her music brings back a lot of good memories of when I was first branching out into Japanese Pop. I just expected more out of her Exodus album is all. I was expecting something like how she did Simple and Clean. English versions of previously released Japanese songs. I think that traveling and Deep River and such would have made great English songs and I think that the album would have done much better in the US if she had done just that. I must admit that I do enjoy some songs from her Exodus album every now and then -- I very much like Exodus '04 -- XD it was like the only song I would listen to when I first purchased her album. I appreciate your imput and your opinion on the overall review of Exodus and Utada's US career. ^_^ It was nice exploring both sides of the issue. ^^

i couldnt agree more...her songs could be better....but what really are we discussing about? ayu vs hikki or...... hikki exodus album? im kinda confuse.. XD

[fantaisie.sign]

To try to put this back on topic. . .

I like watching the Hikki/Ayu "showdowns." It just adds more fun to watching the charts and see who ends up on top. I'm excited about HEAVEN and Be My Last because I'm fans of both Ayu and Hikki, but I'll probably end up buying HEAVEN and waiting for Hikki's album, however far in the future that will be.

[[biku]]

Or Ayu and Hikki can have the last laugh when they release a duet together instead. Mahaha .... right. But I would like to hear their contrasting vocals. Ayu's is more clear and strong whereas Hikki is more subtle but moving. Hm ....
Before I die, I would like to see Hikki do the TRAUMA dance ... XD------------ oh golly. Maybe that's a bit much.

[capsule]

Originally Posted by ayu_fan929

well...its not really a battle since its on different release dates. i think ayu's on 9.21, while hikki's on 9.28. if they were on the same release dates, then this would b huge! ayu's gonna b #1 on the 1st week, then hikki will b #1 the next.

as for sales, i'd guess AFTER i hear both HEAVEN n Be my Last in full version. i'd also c how ayu is doing w/fairyland 1st, b4 i make the guess.

i think Distance won A-BEST by like a couple 1000 (?)

Yeah right Distance beat A BEST by nearly 1 million copies. Distance sold 5.3 million copies in japan and A BEST sold 4.25 million copies. Moreover, Distance contributed over 3 million copies in it's first-week sales!!!!! But, 4.25 million is still an impressive number. Right?